VW TDI EPA Recall (2.0L and 3.0L)

Stabone33 · Apr 21, 2016

blaktransam said:
Saw the quote below on Bloomberg:

The plan covers about 480,000 2.0-liter diesel vehicles in the U.S. and will include some buybacks. What to do about 85,000 VW, Audi and Porsche models with 3.0-liter engines is still to be worked out.

Just curious why they would be treated differently, other than because the premium vehicles are far more expensive and thus, should carry a higher compensation package.

By the way, I absolutely LOVE my Touaregs
bta

The difference is that the 3.0L engines may be able to be brought into compliance with a minor software upgrade vs a full exhaust system redesign as would be necessary for the non-SCR 2.0L engines - i.e., a service notice rather than a recall/buyback.

The compensation for us may only be to make us whole from a resale value, since our vehicles are currently implicated and it's reasonable to expect that stigma may linger for a while even if the engines are eventually deemed technically clean. That will take some Ken Feinberg calculus to determine what that looks like.

Philth · Apr 21, 2016

Stabone33 said:
The difference is that the 3.0L engines may be able to be brought into compliance with a minor software upgrade vs a full exhaust system redesign as would be necessary for the non-SCR 2.0L engines - i.e., a service notice rather than a recall/buyback.

The compensation for us may only be to make us whole from a resale value, since our vehicles are currently implicated and it's reasonable to expect that stigma may linger for a while even if the engines are eventually deemed technically clean. That will take some Ken Feinberg calculus to determine what that looks like.

I'll add that the Gen 2 engines (Passat) are probably going to be harder to bring into compliance since the urea is not preheated by the engine.

VeeDoubleYou · Apr 21, 2016

fincher said:
I believe it. I think VeeDoubleYou has a 2016 TDI Lux...he did not update his vehicle under his screen name.

When I signed up, the forum software only went up to 2015 as a selection. I'll see if they've updated the options so I can fix that.

And the person was correct who said the 2016 incentives differed from the 2015s. Although both were available for sale, my salesperson strongly encouraged me to choose the 2016 arguing that the depreciation on the 2015 would more than eat up the difference in discounts being offered. I believe I got $5500 off plus 0.9% for 72 months, and put down some cash to cover the tax difference from my lower-priced trade-in. I felt like I did ok on the deal at the time, and 0.9% is almost free money. I love watching my amount owed drop by almost the full amount of my payment every month!

fincher · Apr 21, 2016

You got a very good deal at $5500 off and 0.9%.

VeeDoubleYou · Apr 21, 2016

fincher said:
You got a very good deal at $5500 off and 0.9%.

I thought so, too, so this is why although I've been outspoken on this since yesterday, I don't feel the need to lose my mind over it. I think VW is still (probably correctly) arguing the 3.0L software is not a cheat device, but was able to persuade the government and owners' lawyers to defer the 3.0L issue in order to reach an agreement on the 2.0L.

nickm · Apr 21, 2016

VeeDoubleYou said:
I'm pretty sure it's VW that has cornered the market on inexplicable greed, so let's not lose perspective here.

I think the disconnect is many are expecting a best-case scenario (3.0 is cleared or a fix comes out with imperceptible loss of power/MPG) while others of us are seeing worst-case scenario (higher loss in resale and seeing the awesome TDI power and MPG being neutered by a fix). I think our expectations will align much more closely in a few days when all the facts come out.

As for TDI inventory, don't you think the dealers will have a lot of TDI inventory after a six month back log at the port? I guess maybe VW quit shipping them here at some point right after the stop sale? If so, that's good news.

I think waiting for all the facts to show up makes a whole lot more sense than saying "we want more money".

There is no 6 month pileup, the stop sell also meant re-routing production to parts in the world where the vehicle sells (ie: china). The timing also helped them meet the demand of the new Q7 as it gets its body punched out at the same plant as the Touareg.

Perry01 · Apr 21, 2016

tregger said:
Overall, whether you are a 2.0 or 3.0L owner no one will be happy. Ultimately, this negotiation is between VW and the government and the lil guy/us always gets screwed.

What are you talking about? If VW buys my Golf TDI back (it cost $30k new) at FMV and includes $5,000 compensation plus dealer cash I'll get a 2016 GTI and be very happy. I drove a MK 7 GTI last week and they are amazing cars. I'll also have my Touareg too.
.

VeeDoubleYou · Apr 21, 2016

nickm said:
I think waiting for all the facts to show up makes a whole lot more sense than saying "we want more money".

There is no 6 month pileup, the stop sell also meant re-routing production to parts in the world where the vehicle sells (ie: china)

I don't think people are stating "we want more money" in a vacuum, we're saying if a software/hardware fix reduces performance, MPG, and resale value, then there should be compensation, and such compensation should be proportional to the loss. As for waiting for the facts, when has that ever gotten in the way of a spirited Internet conversation?

Glad to hear there is not a backlog of vehicles. I swore I read someone post seeing a ton of TDIs being held at a port, but maybe those are mostly the smaller vehicles.

Philth · Apr 21, 2016

fincher said:
You got a very good deal at $5500 off and 0.9%.

Got $7,000 off at .9% on my '16

fincher · Apr 21, 2016

Philth said:
Got $7,500 off at .9% on my '16

And, and even better deal! When JimBuffalo chimes in, he will tell you about how he got the full $8000 off. Are you going to sell yours in 24 months?

Oregon TDI · Apr 21, 2016

Perry01 said:
I drove a MK 7 GTI last week and they are amazing cars. I'll also have my Touareg too.
.

I have a '15 GTI MK-7, and a Touareg TDI. They're both amazing.

m-fine · Apr 21, 2016

VeeDoubleYou said:
I don't think people are stating "we want more money" in a vacuum, we're saying if a software/hardware fix reduces performance, MPG, and resale value, then there should be compensation, and such compensation should be proportional to the loss. As for waiting for the facts, when has that ever gotten in the way of a spirited Internet conversation?

Glad to hear there is not a backlog of vehicles. I swore I read someone post seeing a ton of TDIs being held at a port, but maybe those are mostly the smaller vehicles.

I totally agree with this, but it is a very big "if" at this point. I am expecting the 3.0 fix will have a fairly limited impact on mpg and performance. If I am wrong, I will want compensation. If I am correct, I am very happy to accept anything they offer, even if it is nothing more than the $1,000 I already received.

Philth · Apr 21, 2016

fincher said:
And, and even better deal! When JimBuffalo chimes in, he will tell you about how he got the full $8000 off. Are you going to sell yours in 24 months?

My mistake. Just double checked the numbers. It was a hair under $7,000 off. $6,995

fincher · Apr 21, 2016

m-fine said:
I totally agree with this, but it is a very big "if" at this point. I am expecting the 3.0 fix will have a fairly limited impact on mpg and performance. If I am wrong, I will want compensation. If I am correct, I am very happy to accept anything they offer, even if it is nothing more than the $1,000 I already received.

I am the person who said there are tons of TDIs sitting in Houston, which is my port of entry. Yes, a bit of hyperbole. I think my post yesterday was almost entirely hyperbole. Do I think there are some sitting on the ground here...yes, I do.

VeeDoubleYou · Apr 21, 2016

Philth said:
Got $7,000 off at .9% on my '16

Nice! I think some of what would have been my discount helped pay off my trade-in vehicle.

tms0425 · Apr 21, 2016

fincher said:
I am the person who said there are tons of TDIs sitting in Houston, which is my port of entry. Yes, a bit of hyperbole. I think my post yesterday was almost entirely hyperbole. Do I think there are some sitting on the ground here...yes, I do.

Hopefully not underwater! My daughter's family lives near downtown Houston and it's mighty damp there right now

Oregon TDI · Apr 21, 2016

WV MetroNews – WVU engineer and Volkswagen emissions researcher is Time’s top 100

MORGANTOWN, W.Va. — In one day two major announcements were released regarding WVU research that had an international impact on the diesel car industry and national impact on emissions policy.

Dan Carder, the director for WVU’s Center for Alternative Fuels, Engines and Emissions, led a team of engineers that discovered Volkswagen falsified emissions information.

Carder has since been named one of Time Magazine’s 100 most influential people in the world.

lml999 · Apr 21, 2016

Oregon TDI said:
WV MetroNews – WVU engineer and Volkswagen emissions researcher is Time’s top 100

MORGANTOWN, W.Va. — In one day two major announcements were released regarding WVU research that had an international impact on the diesel car industry and national impact on emissions policy.

Dan Carder, the director for WVU’s Center for Alternative Fuels, Engines and Emissions, led a team of engineers that discovered Volkswagen falsified emissions information.

Carder has since been named one of Time Magazine’s 100 most influential people in the world.

Maybe they will name a battleship after him!

nickm · Apr 21, 2016

VeeDoubleYou said:
I don't think people are stating "we want more money" in a vacuum, we're saying if a software/hardware fix reduces performance, MPG, and resale value, then there should be compensation, and such compensation should be proportional to the loss. As for waiting for the facts, when has that ever gotten in the way of a spirited Internet conversation?

Glad to hear there is not a backlog of vehicles. I swore I read someone post seeing a ton of TDIs being held at a port, but maybe those are mostly the smaller vehicles.

Fully agree with you you on that! From what I've heard the backup has been with jettas plus any of the 2.0 cars stuck at dealer lots. From what I've seen any dealer that had. Q7 or Touareg TDI in stock quickly turned it into an employee car and then sold it As a used vehicle. I'm sure there will be some deals but they might tighten up supply by skipping 2017 model year and just showing up with the next gen 18 (assuming it shows up on these shores)

nickyt · Apr 21, 2016

It might be MY18 before the engines are ran through enough emission tests to be certified for sale. (I hope not, but this is a crazy crazy crazy mess.)

VW TDI EPA Recall (2.0L and 3.0L)

Stabone33

Philth

VeeDoubleYou

fincher

VeeDoubleYou

nickm

Perry01

VeeDoubleYou

Philth

fincher

Oregon TDI

m-fine

Philth

fincher

VeeDoubleYou

tms0425

Oregon TDI

lml999

nickm

nickyt

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