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Premium Fuel: To Buy or Not to Buy?

4.2K views 40 replies 11 participants last post by  SaVAGeSoot  
#1 ·
This thread will not provide a definitive answer, I am afraid, but rather suggest a possible method of measuring the difference between standard fuel without additives and premium fuel with additives.

Volkswagen recommends in the user manual that premium fuel be used (chapter Fuel, p. 315 in my case). I have always wondered whether this makes any real difference and finally decided to measure that difference somehow. As I am mainly interested in the alleged cleaning properties of premium fuel, I have used the value IDE05857 DPF statistics: current measured charging rate in Address 01: Engine in VCDS. This method shows the real charging rate of the particle filter in grams per kilometer. This method has certain caveats because the rate is influenced by other factors such as the driving style (acceleration, towing, using the low-gear transmission), weather conditions (temperature) and quality of fuel from different manufacturers. This is why a certain fluctuation needs to be tolerated (I would allow at least +/- 0.005 g/km) and not be attributed to better properties of premium fuel. What probably matters more than the absolute values for standard fuel and premium fuel is the difference between them. I used standard diesel and Shell V-Power Diesel/Verva Diesel/Diesel +, which are just different brand names for the same product from a local refinery. According to the manufacturer, the additives in the premium fuel are oxidants supporting fuel combustion, which results in less soot. The results are interesting:

Address 01: Engine (7P1 907 401 F)

standard fuel: IDE05857 DPF statistics: current measured charging rate 0.0409 g/km

premium fuel: IDE05857 DPF statistics: current measured charging rate 0.0129 g/km

The drop is so significant that it would be tempting to conclude that the premium fuel did work and was worth buying, but it is too early and more data and longer measuring periods are needed in my view. Therefore, if you can provide the data for your car or have a different method of measuring premium fuel effectiveness, please post them here.
 
#3 ·
Lots of factors, but I'll pull those same MVBs off mine next time I scan it to see if there's any comparison to yours.
Here's something that you may want to read which may or may not give you some useful info
 
#5 ·
Premium diesel is normally offered at 95% of filling stations here and throughout Europe (Where I have been, at least.) under the names described above (blue colour) together with standard diesel (black colour) and so are their petrol equivalents. It is typically described by filling station chains on their websites (E. g., Paliva Shell V-Power in Czech only, when I switch to the US, I cannot see Shell V-Power Diesel.) as "Our best diesel fuel" and it is claimed to "protect and clean the fuel system". When you ask filling station staff how this "best fuel" cleans the fuel system, they are typically unable to explain, which is why I have found out which refinery they buy it from and asked the refinery.
 
#6 ·
Here you go... Straight off daily duty
Code:
IDE00432 Particle filter: time since last regeneration 5725 s
  IDE00433 Particle filter: oil ash volume 0.25 l
  IDE00434 Particle filter: soot mass calculated 11.74 g
  IDE00435 Particle filter: soot mass measured 11.75 g
  IDE00436 Particle filter: kilometers since last regeneration 73285 m
  IDE00584 Distance driven since erasing DTC memory 13147 km
  IDE00603 Number of driving cycles since erasing DTC memory 255
  IDE01922 Vehicle distance driven 184555 km
  IDE03386 Long-term adaptation of reduction agent dosage 0.90
  IDE05857 DPF statistics: current measured charging rate 0.1514 g/km
  IDE06983-MAS05392 Diesel emissions re-treatment: status-Average distance between DPF regenerations 906 km
  IDE07197   Average reducing agent since lest filling 1.06 l/1000 km
Canadian pump diesel with me adding treatment at each fill. Also dieselgate fixed and 100% stock.
 
#16 ·
We’ll, it looks like they got slammed in EU after the EPA took their shot. In the below quote, “merely protecting car engines” in this case refers to overall reliability of the motor + emissions system. The defeats put very little strain on the emissions system for reliability.

“The European Union’s top court ruled on Thursday that Volkswagen breached the law by installing on its cars a so-called defeat device to cheat on emission tests and cannot argue it was merely protecting car engines.”

 
#19 ·
I like following this for some strange reason ,since I disposed of my TDI recently. I do love the diesel engines in the VWs and am coming to the conclusion through observation that the EU cars have been given some form of pass on the emission standards that has kept them from the horrors of NA cars. Probably because the EU usage of diesel cars is way higher than the NA penetration because of the need for better fuel economy. Cost of fuel in Europe gives me a nose bleed,so it makes sense.
I did notice that on my many trips overseas almost all the cars there are in fact diesel.
Just my observation
 
#20 ·
I have yet to see any proper data supplied by our friends on the other side of the pond to draw a clear conclusion.
There's been a few who have provided basic stats, but if everyone were to supply more detailed starts like I'm showing above in #6, we may have some clarity.
Here's what I've said in my other post, a while ago
 
#25 ·
Europe has a minimum diesel cetane of 51, North America its 40. The premium diesel in europe is around 60. The quality of the combustion is better and you get a more complete burn which means less soot and CO2. NOx limits are higher in Europe than North America but CO2 levels are stricter in europe than North America. In basic terms they want you to burn more fuel to keep emissions lower in North America while they want you to burn less fuel but emit a bit more emissions in europe.
When you mention the cetane number, the premium diesel I use is claimed by the manufacturer to have 58 as opposed to standard diesel from the same refinery that is claimed to have 53. The premium diesel is also claimed to have better lubrication abilities and freeze at temperatures 2 degrees Celsius lower than standard diesel. The trouble is that these claims are not easy to verify although the manufacturer has quality certificates and various test results. That is why I am trying to prove or refute the claim that the premium diesel cleans the system by better combustion.
 
#24 ·
And because I'm not easily convinced by snake oil, here are the same stats off the same vehicle, from the same fuel, but from a typical weekend use scenario (read longer leasurely drives, mostly on cruise) instead of the daily duty one posted above (read going to work, running around for shopping, etc)

Code:
IDE00432   Particle filter: time since last regeneration 26006 s
  IDE00433   Particle filter: oil ash volume 0.26 l
  IDE00434   Particle filter: soot mass calculated 19.95 g
  IDE00435   Particle filter: soot mass measured 21.01 g
  IDE00436   Particle filter: kilometers since last regeneration 462305 m
  IDE00584   Distance driven since erasing DTC memory 13536 km
  IDE00603   Number of driving cycles since erasing DTC memory 255 
  IDE01922   Vehicle distance driven 184944 km
  IDE03386   Long-term adaptation of reduction agent dosage 0.90 
  IDE05857   DPF statistics: current measured charging rate 0.0439 g/km
  IDE06983-MAS05392   Diesel emissions re-treatment: status-Average distance between DPF regenerations 906 km
  IDE07197   Average reducing agent since lest filling 1.06 l/1000 km
So I'd suggest that if you want to compare different fuels, you try to do so while controlling as many variables as possible to ensure that you're driving in the same conditions, at the same loads and speeds, same roads, same temps, etc
 
#26 ·
And because I'm not easily convinced by snake oil, here are the same stats off the same vehicle, from the same fuel, but from a typical weekend use scenario (read longer leasurely drives, mostly on cruise) instead of the daily duty one posted above (read going to work, running around for shopping, etc)

Code:
IDE00432   Particle filter: time since last regeneration 26006 s
  IDE00433   Particle filter: oil ash volume 0.26 l
  IDE00434   Particle filter: soot mass calculated 19.95 g
  IDE00435   Particle filter: soot mass measured 21.01 g
  IDE00436   Particle filter: kilometers since last regeneration 462305 m
  IDE00584   Distance driven since erasing DTC memory 13536 km
  IDE00603   Number of driving cycles since erasing DTC memory 255
  IDE01922   Vehicle distance driven 184944 km
  IDE03386   Long-term adaptation of reduction agent dosage 0.90
  IDE05857   DPF statistics: current measured charging rate 0.0439 g/km
  IDE06983-MAS05392   Diesel emissions re-treatment: status-Average distance between DPF regenerations 906 km
  IDE07197   Average reducing agent since lest filling 1.06 l/1000 km
So I'd suggest that if you want to compare different fuels, you try to do so while controlling as many variables as possible to ensure that you're driving in the same conditions, at the same loads and speeds, same roads, same temps, etc
Thanks.
 
#35 ·
Not only soot is concerned with fuel quality. But also injectors. fuel oil has mineral compounds inside (sodium potassium etc..) and it can agregate with organic compounds (Carbon and Hydrogen from fuel) to form carboxylate salts. These chemicals will deposit on injectors needles and wear it leading to decrease of injection quality then combustion quality, that will cause other damages donwstream due to bad combustion quality. Premium fuels includes additive to disolve carboxylate salts and prevent from injector needles corrosion with these. Sulfur also is a great injector destroyer and premium fuels may content less sulfur. That is to say that when diesel engines are concerned, injection quality is the mother of all issues: Turbo clogging, high DPF soot rate, EGR clogging, intake manifold soot deposits... then all is nightmare. So at first, keep your injectors clean and in good shape and all downstream issues will not happen. Use premium fuel , this will not kill you. If your injectors life tilme is extended , even just a little, and your Turbo, EGR and DPF run always clean then you will not regret the choice
 
#37 ·
I have measured these values numerous times since my last post in this thread and the figures I get seem to justify the conclusion that using premium fuel does result in less soot.

In the process of measuring them, I also made an interesting observation: I noticed the following intermittent fault in VCDS:

9491 - Oil Pressure Regulating Valve
P164E 00 [044] - Electrical Malfunction

I tested it for about 1500 km to find out whether the valve (06E115243H) was really faulty. The IDE05857 DPF statistics: current measured charging rate value skyrocketed during that period. The valve was faulty and when I replaced it, the value dropped to where it had been before the valve became faulty. When functioning properly, the valve reduces the engine oil pressure when RPM is low and increases the pressure when RPM is high. If the valve is faulty, the system resorts to keeping the high oil pressure all the time to prevent engine damage. That probably results in more oil getting into the fumes and consequently in more soot.

The interesting thing is that no MIL was on when the fault (priority 2) was present. Therefore, drivers who do not diagnose their cars regularly have no chance to notice this and could stress their engine oil system and soot their DPFs unnecessarily for quite a long time.
 
#38 ·
I have measured these values numerous times since my last post in this thread and the figures I get seem to justify the conclusion that using premium fuel does result in less soot.
Interesting. All my records show varying values but the only variable between all my readings is the driving pattern and climate conditions.
 
#41 ·
I've never actually logged this MVB on a drive, which I believe is the way to do it if you want to base anything on the value. It doesn't appear to be an average value, but more of a live data point... so in my readings, it's just the latest scenario prior to me parking.... logging it over a specific route would probably reveal similar close deviations as what you're reporting.