Here's the procedure that's used:

Performance Requirements

Speed rating is more a measure of a tire's build and component quality (in a lab setting) than of its actual handling characteristics. Given a choice between H (130mph) and V (149mph), the speed rating would be probably the least important characteristic I'd consider when choosing between two tires for a Treg. If I was buying tires for, say, a 911 that spends a lot of time at the track, yea, it would definitely be a consideration, but for your average car, as long as it isn't ridiculously low (implying poor build quality and possibly poor performance), it shouldn't concern one overmuch.

 

So, CB62,
discounting the high speed part of the equation, would you think that a V rated tire might be a slightly better performer with road handling maneuvers or on snaking curves, or in a high speed emergency braking event as compared to the same tire in and H rating?

Again, i am not interested in how fast a tire will safely go....I'm too old for that at this point. I seem to recall that in the early days of tire ratings, manufacturers had a more verbal push to get the customer to purchase higher rated tires based on performance...other than simply high speed alone.

If there were a slightly better performance, wouldn't you choose the better performing tire?

 

I think the H is all I'd ever need, but, just in case if I'll be involved in high-speed-chase-agent-007-type of run I might like to have 149 MPH rated tires! Seriously... I would guess that the V tires are stiffer than H, but I do not think that this can be noticeable in a fashion other than with some specialized measurement tools. Based on the CT info, most Touareg owners replacing tires every 25K-30K miles which amounts in my case to approximately 2 years, so the only what I care about is the tire driving quality - such as handling, resistance to hydroplaning, etc. And the speed rating comes to the equation even less important than tire looks - i.e. too unimportant to be a significant factor.

 

The V rated tire will actually wear faster due to it being more of a grip type tire as well as high speed running tire. I would not invest in a set for a Touareg if it were me. I remember going through sets of V rated tires like crazy on a supercharged Thunderbird I once owned regardless if abused or not. I was averaging 13K miles a set in that car. It was on it's third set when I sold it with only 27K original miles on it.

 

Anyone that drove a Rabbit GTI in the mid 80's with pirelli p6's knows what sticky tires are with high speed ratings, and how fast they wear.

 

Anyone that drove a Rabbit GTI in the mid 80's with pirelli p6's knows what sticky tires are with high speed ratings, and how fast they wear.

or just ask any of today's Formula one teams...

Facing an uproar in F1 over exploding tires, FIA green-lights Pirelli to run in-season tests | Fox News

 

I was always told that the higher the rating the better the tire is overall. This dosent seem to be the case anymore. The Khumos i have on the T-reg are okay they grip no where near as hard as the Michelins i use to have on it. As far as speed rating goes its electronically limited to 130 mph so doesent really matter there. I would say if it dosent get in to triple digits speed for extended periods of time and you dont charge mountain roads like its a GTI in extreme heat you should be fine with a H rated tire.

 

grip is inversely related to tread life, not so much to speed rating (which is really what H and V are). Grippier tires wear out faster as the rubber is softer.

ASAIK, the biggest difference in speed rating is in the construction of the carcass of the tire (aka - the innards). Higher speeds generate more heat, so the tire needs to be less susceptible to heat build up and have a stouter construction. The cap on the tire (aka - the tread) could be the same, made out of the same compounds and last the same length of time across H and V tires.

 

grip is inversely related to tread life, not so much to speed rating (which is really what H and V are). Grippier tires wear out faster as the rubber is softer.

ASAIK, the biggest difference in speed rating is in the construction of the carcass of the tire (aka - the innards). Higher speeds generate more heat, so the tire needs to be less susceptible to heat build up and have a stouter construction. The cap on the tire (aka - the tread) could be the same, made out of the same compounds and last the same length of time across H and V tires.

Yep, this is almost exactly the case - if you look at the testing methodology, it's all about sustained high-speed runs, which stresses the internal components of the tire. The fact that the cap of most high-speed rated tires is sticky is more about achieving a high traction score - it has nothing to do with the speed rating per se. That being said, since the construction of high speed rated tires is generally more robust, they tend to have slightly better handling characteristics outside of traction due to stiffer sidewalls and better between-ply adhesive specs.

 

Thanks to all for giving thoughts on this question. I am about to order a set of tires for my Treg and am contemplating which rating to go with as ...I mentioned price is not an issue. Perhaps with the Treg history with poor tire wear I had better stick with the H rated version.
I appreciate all of your efforts in the discussion. If others have further thoughts, please fell free to include them. It will be a few days yet before I need to order.

Oh yeah...I once had a set of Pirelli P-Zero Rosso's when they first came out...on a GTI and I virtually watched them evaporate before my eyes! Probably before some of you were born...

 

Thanks to all for giving thoughts on this question. I am about to order a set of tires for my Treg and am contemplating which rating to go with as ...I mentioned price is not an issue. Perhaps with the Treg history with poor tire wear I had better stick with the H rated version.
I appreciate all of your efforts in the discussion. If others have further thoughts, please fell free to include them. It will be a few days yet before I need to order.

Oh yeah...I once had a set of Pirelli P-Zero Rosso's when they first came out...on a GTI and I virtually watched them evaporate before my eyes! Probably before some of you were born...

Which two tires are you looking at? Maybe someone has some experience with the sets you're considering - which would likely be more useful than comparing the speed ratings!

The OE Scorpion Verdes are crap - after 6000 miles the wear is blatantly obvious...

 

Treadwear is related to tread wear rating not speed rating though some/most higher speed rated tires have worse ratings than a similar lower rated tire Primacy H versus V.

I once put a T rated tire on my Honda, rated for an H rated tire. I had a H rated tire prior( I went T for a higher tredwear rating) I hated the t and took it back for the H and had the same crisp steering , less wandering ride I had before. Always go with recommended speed rating or higher . I drive 35k a year for last 15 years have had many different rated tires. Always happy with a V rated tire at least in an premium all season which is what I use. Higher speed rating does make a noticable difference in higher end tires, JMO.

Turanza T to H noticable difference
Primacy H to V noticable difference
Assurance H to Assurance V "" "" I have driven these 6 tires, some where on the car when I bought it and wore them out, some where my mistake like the Turanza

 

cb62, I'd rather not get into specific brands. I am trying to keep the discussion theoretical across the board as there are a number of fans for various brands here. I do have my own favorites based on my prior experience.

Again, it's the construction of the performance levels I am trying to sort out.

warminwisco, thanks for your experience and thoughts on rating differences. I tend to agree with the thinking that the higher rated tire will have a (somewhat) better feel. I may give up a little in mileage with the higher rating.

Since I'm currently running on an H rated tire, I may go up to the next level to compare. My current tires have worn very well and evenly. I haven't been disappointed.

 

I feel it is a diservice to the goal of sorting out tires to say "I do not plan on driving that fast" Often the higher speed rated tires are but a few dollars more or less i.e. Primacy v versus H. I never found d a higher speed rated tire felt jarring bumps more or made the car feel twitchy, on the contrary was always a positive experience. The Turanza mistake, I put the T's on my minivan as it was rated for T's and thought "it is a great tire on my Caravan I will get more miles on my honda" opened my eyes. The poor Firestone dealer, those tires sat in the waiting area with a discounted price on them for months. A good, smart tire dealer will not put a tire on rated for less than the car was made for.

 

To cut to the quick, applications are really the key. The easiest thing to do (money being no object) are to have and use multiple sets (4 each = 1 set) of T/R combinations. This way one can get the appropriate wear for intended application and conditions.

Another issue seems to be that of the three tire sizes, (18 in (Sport) 19 in (Lux) 20 in (Exec) ) the latter two sizes seem to (structurally) wear much faster than the smallest size (18 in.) That is with the higher UTQG ratings. Since I swag that most (67%) of the Touareg fleet are the 19 in and 20 in sizes, this is a common structural issue.

As an example the third rated OE tire (GY LS2's) on 18 in rims get app 14,500 to 15,000 miles per 1/32nd in of wear. So at 31,000 miles there is ever so slightly less than 8/32nd in of thread left. They start with 10/32nd in of tread and even have a lower UTQG (400) rating than so called oe crap "faster wearing"(UTQG 600) tires, albeit larger diameter sizes. I would also swag that if VW engineers kept the 17 in tires they would wear better still.

 

I am more inclined to believe that the ratio is 40/40/20 for Execs, Lux, and Sports.... VW accountants like to make lots of money on all the loaded up optioned versions, and provide sports just to say touaregs "start at $42,000" for marketing purposes.

 

From what I know about tires... or tyres! (Nooby) V speed rating verses H rating. A V rated tire is not stiffer... It is usually a lower profile of sidewall to help reduce wall flex which in turn reduces heat buildup when at max speed. Since this tire has less sidewall flex it transfers more energy from the road to other components such as suspension, chassis, etc... which seems like it is stiffer.
So a V rated tire will have a thinner, lower sidewall compared to a H rated tire. Usually they are also more expensive due to marketing hype that manufactures apply. This is very very subjective depending on the tire manufacture. Compounds will also play a factor. Again, like anything else in the world, you must do your research and not get swayed by the rubbish that the marketing dept tries to push.

 

I'm sorry but my question states that the 2 tires would be the same size, section and indistinguishable visually, so lower sidewall doesn't apply to the question. I also stated that price was not a differential. I am asking if anyone has knowledge of the internal structure and/or composition of the tire that would make it better for everyday driving. Thoughts about my driving at 150 mph for sustained time isn't part of my question either.

Again, if you had two identical sets of new tires before you to choose from; one H rated and one V rated..and they were free, which set would you take and why?

 

I think the Ameoba’s post was very conclusive. Speed rating is about the inner strength of the tire. They use different materials or more materials to make V vs. H tires of the same make/model. For an instance, H-rated OE 19" size Goodyear Eagle LS2 tire is 1 lbs. lighter than a similar tire with V-rating. I believe that having more liner materials or heavier materials (some makers use Kevlar-type fibers) makes the ride stiffer overall, though the rubber compounds used most likely are absolutely the same. Having heavier tires will inevitably result in lower MPG. Personally, I would go with a better buy or, if prices are equal, with the V-rated set (007 is my part-time job).

 

Since the vehicle is limted to 130MPH, its impossible to have sustained speeds > 130MPH. (assuming you can even find a place to do it). Any quality tire that is H rated is the right choice..I'd be more concerned with load rating than speed rating in any case.

speed rating is just a measure of a tires ability to run at sustained speeds..they end up building a heavier tire to get a higher speed rating. its not a "better" tire or higher quality, just made for a different purpose.

 

Glad this was here... looking at some tires on tire rack right now... thinking about the Scorpion Verde All Season ( H rated )or Continental Ex Contact DWS ( v rated ) .... the P's are 191 per tire and the C's are 212.... these also caught my eye and seem similar to the P's ... CrossContact LX20 with EcoPlus Technology ... 190 per tire ( h rated).

 

I haven’t personally tried the LX20, but they are ranked the highest all-season truck tires by the Consumer Reports. While I do not trust all they say (because by default their opinion is biased), it is still a good reference point…

 

i went from a h rating of the same brand of tires to a v rating and the difference is quite noticeable. the v rating has a smoother quieter ride.

 

Did you buy tires with the identical tread as it is the latter meeting the road surface that generates noise.

Tires can get a lot noisier as they wear which is why I no longer recommend General UHPs nor General ATs.

Michelin Latitude Cross may be more expensive but, so far, relative silence, excellent wear rate and far superior grip in all conditions on and off road than the Grabber ATs. Oh, and they're H rated!

Back to the original question though: I think you would have to be driving on the limit to even start to try and find a noticeable difference in grip between H and V rated tires since the H/V rating is to do with the maximum sustained speed and not grip which is down to the design of the tread, the construction of the tire and the compound used, and the grip of tires of any rating will also be dependent upon the road surface and ambient conditions [and the car and the driver!] so there are probably far too many variables to draw any firm conclusions.

It might be fun but trying to find that additional edge on the public highway would probably attract unwanted attention from the police!

 

I saw the LX eco20 tires the other day. Nice deep tread for long wear I would think. I did not see them in 275/45/20.

I bought the Turanza T's for my Accord, no not a Treg. My arm was so sore after 3 days trying to keep the tire from kind of wandering with minot steering adjustments on the breezeway on my 90k r/t drive to work. I couldn't take it and got the H's from Firestone(I think a different tread pattern though), all solved.

I have had the Primacy h's on my LS, I put 160k on them then got a V rated Primacy(same exact tread pattern) and noticed the difference in just a crisper tire. Mileage if anything got better but hard to tell. Anyway, I drive alot of miles wish I didn't gotta eat.

All of this just my experience.

 

Those Eco's have a tread depth of 12/32 and wear rating of 70k. As you would expect with the deep tread a bunch of em have an S rating, a majority a T rating and a few an H. Like to try those beasts for wear on my 012 exec after seeing the dismal wear of OEM tires. I would want at least an H though and not offered anyway in a 45.

 

160k on the LS I meant went thru a bunch of tires

 

I use 265/50/19 "Y" in the summer and 255/60/18 "H" in the winter.

The speed rating is the maximum safely sustained speed for ten minutes. I like a margin of safety when driving a 2-1/2 ton beast with a 2 ton boat behind it. Had blow-outs when I was young and foolish, I'll take the safest tire out there if the price is the same, and pay more just to avoid swerving off the road.

Also used 275/45/19 "Y" -- has better acceleration because the diameter is smaller, but still has a nice ride.

So "H" is ten minutes at 130mph and "V" is ten minutes at 149mph. How about three hours at 60mph pulling a vehicle/trailer rig with a combined weight of five or six tons?

My trailer tires are "Q" rated (99mph, load range D 65# psi).

My cars both have "H" rated tires.

 

The speed rating is the maximum safely sustained speed for ten minutes.

So "H" is ten minutes at 130mph and "V" is ten minutes at 149mph. How about three hours at 60mph pulling a vehicle/trailer rig with a combined weight of five or six tons?

Not quite. Here, again, are the test procedures :
Performance Requirements

"Thus, the 10 minute step duration tests require 50 minutes to complete (10 minutes up to ITS and four 10 minute speed steps = 50 minutes): the 20 minute step duration requires 90 minutes to complete (10 minutes up to ITS and four 20 minute speed steps = 90 minutes); and the 30 minute step duration requires 130 minutes to complete (10 minutes up to ITS and four 30 minute speed steps = 130 minutes). The ITS is 30 km/h less than the speed rating of the tire. "

Or, an alternative test:
"Accelerate at a constant rate such that an initial test speed of 40 km/h (25 mph) less than the speed rating is reached at the end of 10 minutes.

• 10 minutes at 40 km/h (25 mph) less than speed rating
  10 minutes at 30 km/h (19 mph) less than speed rating
  10 minutes at 20 km/h (12mph) less than speed rating
  20 minutes at 10 km/h (6mph) less than speed rating
  After the test, the tire is inspected for visible evidence of failure."

I think the 10 minute intervals threw you off, but speed rating is more complicated than "safe for 10 minutes at this speed". Other factors such as loading, ambient temperature, and road surface have to be considered, with loading having the greatest contribution to the chances of failure due to overheating.

 

I just put on some 255 55 18 COnti DWS and they are awesome.

 

My $0.02

Both my summer and winter sets are V rated. Compared to the stock H rated GY's, the V rated tires produce a stiffer ride and there is more bump feel. But the up side is there is less sway and better road handling on high speed turns.

No one has mentioned the most important part... Load rating. Make sure you purchase the required XL as many tire places do not realize this is required for the touareg and will sell you a SL.

Now after some of you go and read about load ratings you might say, "we'll there isn't much difference in the load ratings." But what you have to realize is the specified load rating is when the tire is at its highest cold tire manufacturer rated pressure. Cut the pressure cut the load rating. BTW VW requires max cold tire sidewall rated pressure when towing.

 

Both my summer and winter sets are V rated. Compared to the stock H rated GY's, the V rated tires produce a stiffer ride and there is more bump feel. But the up side is there is less sway and better road handling on high speed turns.

No one has mention the most important part... Load rating. Make sure you purchase the required XL as many tire places do not realize this is required for the touareg and will sell you a SL.

Now after some you go and read about load ratings you might say, "we'll there isn't much difference in the weight ratings." But what you have to realize is the specified weight rating is when the tire is at its highest cold tire manufacturer rated pressure. Cut the pressure cut the load rating. BTW VW requires max cold tire sidewall rated pressure when towing.

I mentioned load rating being the thing to be concerned with back in post 22. People seem to be confusing speed rating with tire quality. .. the best snow tires tend to be S rated. The speed rating is just that - a guarantee of ability to maintain sustained speed. Important if you live in an area where you consistently get up and over those speeds but otherwise irrelevant.... I don't know of any area in North America where you will be over 130mph consistently over long distances. It has nothing to do with load rating or ability to haul a heavy load over long distance.

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Heat is a real problem for a tire as well: too much and you risk a blow out, but too little and the compound doesn't work optimally.

I'd like to see TPMS giving both pressure AND temperature.

 

About every 10 degrees F is ~1psi change. I set the menu on tire pressure before I turn off my vehicle so I know what I starting off with. You can see a difference between the shaded and sun side but after a few minutes the tire temp and pressure is consistent. A little comparison to the outside temp and you are good to go.

 

Combinations of ratings to address your needs

Either you purchase different sets of tires for different conditions / requirements, or you live with the best compromise between the factors you consider most important.

Remember, aside from speed, tires also are required to be rated based on tread wear, traction, and load range, not just speed. Does a high speed rating correspond with a high temp rating? Usually, but engineers design different tires to do different things well, or to be moderately good at a wider number of things. That's why all the other categories exist.

For example: I currently run 255/60 R 17 106H M+S tires because although I live in the desert and rarely drive in snow or mud, I like to "offroad" (use unimproved roads/ Jeep trails) from time to time, and all-season tires give me better gravel traction than Summer performance or "touring" tires. They have an A temp rating - which I like because I had an expensive "touring" tire blow out (tread separation) at 75 mph and 115 F ambient (so the road itself was probably 140 F or more) - and I'd rather not go through that again. They have an A traction rating, because they have a satisfactory M+S self-cleaning tread design for use on light snow and mud, but also because they have a softer, stickier compound that performs well and wears faster on the dry. I predict will only get about 35K mi out of them, but they are relatively inexpensive. A harder compound might mean less wear, but would likely have a bit less heat-tolerance, which could end up costing a lot more in collateral damage from a catastrophic failure.

They are the compromise that works best for me at this time. My priorities right now are: dry traction, heat-resistance, fuel economy, wet/other traction, cost - in that order. Identify your needs, then weigh all the ratings metrics along with initial and costs over time, and you'll have a shorter list.