Lots of info here: http://www.clubtouareg.com/forums/f49/hybrid-only-79221-20.html#post393148

 

Do an advanced search on title only for BMW.
Several comparison threads.

My last daily driver was a loaded non-sport BMW 3.0i, it was a 2008 and got about 18mpg under similar conditions you describe.

There are many reasons I love the Touareg far above the Bimmer.
There are just a few things I liked on the Bimmer more than the Touareg.

 

Thanks guys -- I read the entire hybrid only thread and the fuel question was somewhat covered -- we were wondering about the "sailing" feature and how many mpg that might add. But I will go over the thread again for sure.

I have also read many comments regarding the BMW X5 (many people on this site prefer the Touareg over it, of course) but I don't see any direct comparisons with the hybrid Touareg. These are all different species here with gas/diesel and hybrid models.

I am trying to get a sense of any downsides to the Touareg hybrid so I can take that into comparison with the known problems of the X5. Trying to be reasonable here!

 

OK -- I reread the entire thread of hybrid only and it raised a few more questions/issues --

1. No Spare Tire -- so I guess I am stuck with runflats always unless I use my trunkspace for a spare? The saving grace of the BMW X5 is that with no 3rd row, I can use the cargo under floor space for one of their space-saver tires and get rid of the horrible run-flat. How is the ride with Touareg original issued run-flats?

2. Didn't see the answer to the question of whether you can jump off your hybrid -- I think it said you can jump off another car but you can't have it done to the hybrid.

3. Does the hybrid run with a dead battery at all? If you can't jump it off, then you are stuck, right, until the tow truck shows up?

4. I read that it might not be smooth acceleration with hybrid in stop/go traffic? If it is hard to control smooth acceleration (not a problem for some, I understand) but is it really jumpy/touchy in stop/go traffic?

5. I read that gas engine is very quick to start in acceleration - so almost no gas savings in slow speeds using hybrid. Some hybrids with a gas engine don't start with gas engine until speeds of over 30 or so mph? If this is a problem for the Touareg, it might be nice to know.

I am just trying to understand any downsides to a hybrid over gas/diesels. Anyone can help with these observations? It would be appreciated.

 

No spare, no run flats just a slime bottle and compressor. I personally carry a tire repair (plug) kit.

No need to worry about battery because if you can't start your car you have much bigger problems than a dead battery.

Once again if you're buying this SUV for its hybrid capabilities then you need to look at a Highlander, Touareg is a performance hybrid, more of a V8 replacement than a Prius.

Acceleration is fine.

 

Performance wise hybrid will be on par or better than anX5 V8, option wise BMW brings more to US than VW. Not sure about reliability as these are too new to determine but considering that these vehicles have a bullet proof Audi engines and a Japanese made transmissions makes me feel much better. 4motion blows Xdrive out of the water, Touareg behaves much better in the snow than an X5 not to mention that the X5 is an outgoing model and T3 recently arrived. Honestly I did not buy my hybrid for a gas mileage, I bought it for its performance, gas mileage is an added bonus for me. Drive it in an E-mode and you'll get an excellent MPG, put your foot down and you'll wake up the beast, Jeckyl and Hyde as "jurgenk" (other member) once called it. I love mine and do not regret my decision, not even for a minute even though I could've bought almost any SUV I wanted, well may be a Cayenne but I could not justify an extra $25K for a fancier skin, but that's just me.

 

I agree with your Cayenne comparison in price -- I just can't look a Lexus without screaming "Toyota" and it is the same with Infinite and Acura.

But as a mom and as a woman, I need safety and reliability and I do like to think that I can have it with a fuel-efficient vehicle that can carry all of the golf bags, horse stuff, etc. and perform well under adverse weather conditions. So that is why I am asking questions about spare tires and jumping off dead batteries. I can't always depend on the tow truck being handy and may need the assistance of kind strangers to get the car up and running.

And as we may be considering a move to icy climates, knowing a Touareg is better in snow/ice than an X5 is a serious benefit.

And you are right again, with the 2014 redesign of the X5, I am considering a soon-to-be-outdated model but as we all know, sometimes they may advance the technology but regress on the car's structural/component integrity which negates any benefit with the technology.

I am also trying to justify the benefit of the hybrid as compared to a Touareg Exec/Lux TDI or gas models. So, there are lots of considerations here.

 

I am also trying to justify the benefit of the hybrid as compared to a Touareg Exec/Lux TDI or gas models. So, there are lots of considerations here.

Go Hybrid or TDI Exec. Lux is my only regret with my new T-Reg!
I miss the parking sensors and heated steering wheel.

 

Whoa -- T-Reguan. Did I read this right?

These tires are not run-flats either? So, what do you do when you get a flat? And I am being serious with the question. Is a tire repair plug kit going to work for a woman stranded? I am so confused here. How do you sell a car with no spare tire and no run-flats?

 

Whoa -- T-Reguan. Did I read this right?

These tires are not run-flats either? So, what do you do when you get a flat? And I am being serious with the question. Is a tire repair plug kit going to work for a woman stranded? I am so confused here. How do you sell a car with no spare tire and no run-flats?

Yup, just can of goo for punctures. And that only works if the hole in the tire is small enough for the goo to seal it. Otherwise it's tow truck time.

I can think of at least three occasions when the lack of a spare wheel would have left me high and dry on the side of the road because the hole in the tire would have been too big - as you unfortunately found out the hard way.

No car maker should allowed to sell a car without a proper spare wheel.

Do not buy a hybrid expecting good fuel economy. The hybrid is a 2.5 ton gas guzzler just like any other big 4x4. The electric motors merely provide another 80 bhp to put a big smile on your face as you floor the throttle pedal. 20 mpg is about the mark so buy a 3.0 Tdi Touareg if you want 50% more per gallon, or a Prius for 100% more!

 

If you get a flat you put the can on the tire valve and refill it..slime comes out and seals the hole, if you can use a can of shaving cream you can use this setup. If you have a total blowout you're outta luck. Can't remember ever getting a flat tire in 25 years of driving so a can of fix a flat is fine for me...if I'm on the side of the freeway the last thing I'm doing is hopping out and tire changing anyways...

Run flats drive like garbage and cost a fortune. I would replace run flats immediately if I ever had a vehicle with them. I'll deal with the flat if I have to.

Saftey wise read up on the euro encap ratings of this vehicle..its a tank. Safest vehicle on the road.

I have a TDI but am shopping out the hybrid, supertruck performance with reasonable fuel economy in a package that is bank vault safe and is very capable in snow...only vehicle on the market that fits that description is the Touareg/Cayenne Hybrid

 

Unless the hybrid differs from the TDI, you will have an uninflated doughnut spare, along with slightly complicated instructions on how to inflate it by connecting an air line (supplied) to the engine. Or maybe its a little air pump; I can't remember. The OEM tires are not runflats.

But I haven't had a flat tire (as opposed to slow leaks) in fifteen years.

 

the hybrid battery takes up the spare tire well in the hybrid vs TDi...TDI has the adblue tank but it fits within the spare tire.

 

I think I need to consider the Exec TDI instead of the hybrid.

I have a healthy respect for flat tires. I was one of those individuals that had the Ford Explorer tire blowout before it was known to be a serious problem. I was 6 months pregnant going 65 on a busy freeway in Houston, TX when it blew into pieces. I managed to pull over to the side of the freeway and a nice person changed my tire so I could make it to the tire store.

So, I do have a personal understanding for having to change a tire under unusual circumstances and the need to have a spare tire.

 

I've owned a couple of VWs over the years. A 2003 Passat W8 and a 2008 R32. Thankfully, they never needed much in the way of service. Also have had a Mini Countryman and my current car, a BMW 335d. Both come standard with runflats.

Reliability has never been a problem with me with either VW. So that wouldn't dissuade me from buying a VW. But I know others who haven't been so luckily. Are dealers convenient to you? Remember that not every VW dealer is certified to service a Hybrid, so that my impact your options. (And that limitation may change with the Jetta Hybrid coming - perhaps more dealerships will be Hybrid service capable.)

Re runflats or lack of a spare - HATED the runflats on the CountryMan. Noisy, harsh ride, bad handling. Swapped for traditional tires. Luckily, never had a problem. The BMW - I've had one flat. Was able to drive about 20 miles to get back home, so that was convenient. Won't have that option or a spare with a Hybrid (which I'm also considering). I'll rely on roadside assistance, whether AAA, my insurance, whomever. Or I could swap on runflats, if they are available in that size.

No real answers for you, but you sort of have to lay out your cards and decide which issues are absolutes and which are nice-to-haves.

And regarding fuel efficiency - on my very recent test drive, I hit over 30 mpg in in-town driving. Admittedly, driving somewhat casually, but I thought that was pretty good. If you think of it as a car that performs like a V8 (or better) with V6 fuel consumption, you'll be on the mark. If you're driving is more skewed towards highway than city, some here have said that a diesel may be a better fit. I'm just the opposite, so I've turned away from the TDI back to the Hybrid.

My 2 cents - good luck!

 

I think Hybrids come with Michelins so less chance of vibration, SUV's will always be more to insure than auto's due to rollover possibility. Wider tires seem to pick up more stuff and a higher chance of flats, at least that has been my experience.

 

OK, here is the point that I get frazzled regarding spare tires and fuel economy.

Fuel economy -- I do probably 80% city and 20% highway so I am assuming that a hybrid will work better for me (based on what I have read from several posts including NashTouareg's messages, etc.).

I have seen the off-frontal safety results for the Prius V, it is not AWD and in a collusion match, I want to win with weight/structure so that car is out.

With the TDI, I don't get much more in mileage savings with my % mix of driving and I have to worry about adblue, fuel pumps going out, etc. -- But I hear great things about the Exec TDI so it should stay on the list of potential cars. The advantages over hybrid is the sound system (not an issue with my FoxNews listening) and 20" wheels (not a necessity to me).

As I need trunk space for golf clubs, etc. I could easily go with a Mercedes GL, Jeep Grand Cherokee, etc. but I am back to 12/18 mpg which I would like to improve upon.

I love the 2012 Mercedes ML Bluetec but my son hates its technology. Go figure.

The BMW Diesel is just noisy so that is getting to be last on the the list -- it also seems to have a problems with the 20" inch wheels wear - lots of noise and uneven wear.

So, for the Touareg hybrid, my remaining big concerns is the jerky motions with slow accelerations, vibrations in steering columns, sunroof too transparent with heat transfer and overall reliability/dependability. But we will be going with a 10 year/100,000 warranty regardless.

Spare Tire -- I just spoke to the salesman and he said that this car comes with an inflatable spare tire. My husband is relieved although I am still a bit concerned. But at least I have something.

Any other comments/ideas? I respect ya'll experience with the hybrid's specific issues.

 

Was your "salesman" confused?

There is no room for a spare wheel in the hydrid.

The spare wheel well is occupied by the batteries that make it a hybrid.

You need to go and look at car the properly and then take it out for a couple of hours to see if you can get it to run on the batteries in town.

I couldn't which is why I regard it as a pretty quick gas guzzler with an electric turbo facility that puts a smile on your face and a dent in your wallet!

 

I don't know if the salesman is confused or not (he is at another location though). We will be going up on Thursday for test drive/possible purchase. We will definitely do the 65-70 highway test for vibration and then will take it on the city road for stop/go (and possibly in a parking lot) to see how the stop/go acceleration works.

Regarding the spare tire question, the salesman did make a call and said that it had an inflatable spare that fit under the cargo area (?) -- we will definitely review the issue closely before buying. But I hope he was right - I will write him back now to confirm.

Now, the smile will be on my 14 year old son (when he learns to drive) and possibly my husband if it is icy conditions (no way he is going to take his BMW 535 with FWD on those roads) -- I will be just happy that we have a fighting chance in a collusion and hopefully a way home if the car stops along the way.

Any other thoughts about hybrid components versus TDI components? Better, not better in quality, less expensive, more expensive in repair cost, more reliability/less reliability, etc.?

 

...
Now, the smile will be on my 14 year old son (when he learns to drive) and possibly my husband if it is icy conditions (no way he is going to take his BMW 535 with FWD on those roads) -- I will be just happy that we have a fighting chance in a collusion and hopefully a way home if the car stops along the way.
...

Before someone jumps on you - the 535 is RWD, or possibly AWD, but not FWD.

Lots to sift through - I'm somewhat in the same boat.

 

From the web - note the "former spare-tire well".

As in most hybrids, the electric motor also restarts the engine, and recharges the 288-volt nickel-metal-hydride battery pack fitted into the former spare-tire well. The hybrid system is tuned to give lots of electric assist at highway speeds, which silences the usual hybrid critics, who frequently gloat that most hybrid systems are useless during Interstate cruises.

 

Find another salesman!

The hybrid hasn't been around long enough for long term reliability issues to be exposed.

One key cost will be battery replacement in the future. Ask how much they are.

Also, only specially trained technicians can work on hybrids due to high voltages and not all dealers will have trained staff.

It's a lovely car and I am sure you will enjoy driving it but beware - you will be buying into a very small, very specialised niche.

 

Cars.com is the only place I've come across that says the 2013 Touareg has run-flats.

Rather than the electrically variable transmissions many hybrids employ, the Touareg Hybrid has a specialized version of the Touareg's eight-speed automatic. The hybrid battery pack resides under the cargo floor, so it doesn't compromise luggage room. That space would ordinarily go toward a spare tire; in lieu of one, the Touareg Hybrid has run-flat tires with a small repair kit. LED taillights are new for 2013.

 

On carconnection.com, in an article about being prepared for a flat tire, I found first explicit statement about the Touareg and "the kit", albeit the article is a few years old..

2011 Volkswagen Touareg Hybrid: inflator and sealant kit


That same carconnection.com article also points to this PDF from AAA which lists all vehicles that do not come with spares, but again, it is from 2011 model years and prior.

If you search on the Porsche Cayenne Hybrid, for 2012 they refer to the same kind of kit, with the tag "It's the sort of things sports car drivers have gotten used to." (The Cayenne and Touareg sharing much of their underpinnings.)

But for 2013, on the Porsche.com site, the Hybrid is described as having 18 inch all seasons, and a collapsible spare tire.

 

This is what is taking the space that would normally hold the spare tire. Ask the dealer to lift that back floor up and show. Very simple to do.

It's a shame you can't see just a bit more to the right in the picture. That's where the "kit" is stored.

 

You will find that run flat tires give you a very choppy, hard ride ( literally zero sidewall flex) and are twice the price of comparable tires, with terrible selection. 99.9% of the time a can of fix a flat, and an AAA membership will do you just fine. If you're really worried about bigger punctures, normally encountered, carry a tire plug kit, those will fix 99% of the remaining punctures. You're not on a trans Siberian expedition.

 

..snip....99.9% of the time a can of fix a flat, and an AAA membership will do you just fine. If you're really worried about bigger punctures, normally encountered, carry a tire plug kit, those will fix 99% of the remaining punctures. You're not on a trans Siberian expedition.

I couldn't agree more. the most unsafe thing you can do is change a spare on the side of the highway...if changing on the drivers side, you risk getting run over thanks to target fixation morons, if on the passenger side, well - enjoy sinking into whatever the hell is on the soft shoulder. Besides the last think I want to do is jack up a 5500lb vehicle using a jack designed to fit in a tiny space - all placed on a soft gravel shoulder. Oh and by the way, to the OP- I hope you are playing in the NFL because you will need the pro football strength to torque the lugs to 133 ft-lb of torque. Good luck doing that with the dinky tire iron!

A blowout to me is outsourced work, I'm not screwing around with changing it roadside...use the fancy phone interface, call guaranteed mobility (part of the warranty deal), a truck shows up and takes care of the problem.

 

Regarding my pursuit of a Hybrid - the dealership is trying to make my trade work. A 2011 BMW 335d Sport. I dropped a bit; will be curious to see what they can do! They seem to have accepted the price I offered for the Touareg!

 

Michelin 265-50/19s were on the Hybrid Touareg I drove, too. I don't think they were runflats. I looked on Tirerack.com and didn't find anything in that size that was a runflat.

And if you're living in Palm Beach County, why are you so worried about icy/snowy roads?!?!?! Sand, I could see <grin>!

 

I also did not see any run flat offerings in the 19" size.

If a spare is a deal-breaker than go with the TDI. I'm getting 23.3mpg long term to date with mostly city driving. . .