[kurtww]

Yesterday we were towing our Airstream up a hill, so the motor was straining some (though we've done it many times without problem). It started making a strange noise, and I was able to pull off pretty quickly. The noise is a loud clattering that gets faster at higher RPMs, but stops briefly when I get off the gas. Here is a link to how it sounds:

It seems to be coming from the top of the engine, maybe the valves? Kind of hard to pinpoint as it's pretty noisy in there. I can take it to the mechanic, but I'm pretty comfortable fixing it myself if it's not too bad.

Thanks for any feedback.

 

[noobytoogy]

Timing chain? If so it is at the rear of the engine and is a b*gger to access without removing said engine.

 

[Spiegelglatt]

That doesn't sound good at all. It sounds like contact between a piston and a valve... timing chain could be the culprit with this. Then again it is hard to tell from a sound clip what it sounds like in person. Might pull the plugs and rotate engine by hand (will be easier with plugs out) and listen with something (screw driver) against block and your ear for contact / metallic sounds.

When you take your foot out of it is interesting. Could cracked exhaust manifold make a sound like this? Not sure if that would explain the noise going away when you take your foot off the gas, but perhaps???

Hard to tell from a sound clip.

Afterthought: make sure your oil level is right on and that you are not low...this could not allow enough force for the chain tensioners to function right...

 

[Dpkhym]

I don't think it's valve damage the engine runs to smoothly. Sounds like a starved or broken hydraulic valve lifter. The noise could also be a bad intake manifold, check the runner linkage near the bulkhead to see if it popped of or is not fully engaged. Any dtc's or warning lamps?

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[kurtww]

Thanks for the replies. The engine does seem to run OK besides the noise. The CEL is on, but it's been on for some time due to an unrelated small thing that our last shop deemed not worth fixing. Obviously that means I have no idea if a new issue has arisen.

It sounds like I need to take it to a good VW guy to get some hands-on advice before digging in too much. I'm definitely not going to be changing the timing chain myself. We've been planning on trading the vehicle in soon anyway. If it is the timing chain, it seems like there will not be much value left in the truck. That would be a bummer. I'll post back when I get some details.

 

[kurtww]

So just to provide an update to this. I took it to a well-respected local shop and they said that it was almost certainly the timing chain. To give a full diagnosis they would need to pull the engine and they aren't equipped to do it. On the short drive over there the engine started running super rough, idle dropping to 400 rpm, to the point where I thought it might die right there.

I called the dealer to ask for the rough cost of replacing the timing chain, and they said about $8k. So I plan to take it to Carmax (on a trailer) and see what they'll give me. Hopefully it's not too bad. They did give me about $2k more than I was expecting a couple years ago on our Beetle convertible, but I suspect this will be a surprise in the other direction. Such is life, the Touareg gave us great service for 11 years!

 

[Dpkhym]

What are your fault codes after bringing it to the independent shop?

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[Spiegelglatt]

Curious about two things 1) mileage on motor and 2) are you going to get a second opinion? Sounds like it is the chain, but seems like second opinion might be warranted given the financial impact from either fixing a unloading (both are expensive).
Also a member with a newer V6 3.6 had timing chain done at independent shop and paid $4,500 or so in and out. For what it is worth.

 

[Dpkhym]

Curious about two things 1) mileage on motor and 2) are you going to get a second opinion? Sounds like it is the chain, but seems like second opinion might be warranted given the financial impact from either fixing a unloading (both are expensive).
Also a member with a newer V6 3.6 had timing chain done at independent shop and paid $4,500 or so in and out. For what it is worth.

I recommend a second opinion as well, $8k USD is too much to pay for that job and you can find it much cheaper elsewhere.

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[kurtww]

The motor has 92k miles on it. $8k is definitely too much for the work, that was just the dealer's quote. The trouble is we're ready to trade this vehicle in and KBB for its condition is only around $4k. My wife dinged it up some as well, so even in perfect mechanical condition it still needs some cleanup. I figure if I have to put $4500 in to fix it, and another $800 to fix the body, I'll be lucky to net $2k when I sell it. Carmax may give me $2-3k as is, I won't know until I take it there. If they really lowball me then I think I'll have to explore fixing it.

I asked the shop about diagnosis codes and they said that they didn't see any codes related misfires or anything related to the timing chain, and that they were "just looking for the cause of the noise". Given that the CEL was flashing on the way over I find that kind of hard to believe. Honestly I'm not too happy that they (Avalon Motorsports in Denver) charged me $160 to diagnose it and then said "We used a stethoscope to listen and we're pretty sure it's coming from the timing chain". That sounds like they could have done that while I was there in 5 minutes.

 

[Spiegelglatt]

Bummer only 92k! Sad to see such a great vehicle go to scrap with so much left on the motor because VW in their over engineering excellence put the stupid timing chain at the back of the motor. Keep us posed, and hope things work out for you.

 

[kurtww]

OK, final update on this. I called a local VW specialist (they were too far to drive to before, but came highly recommended). I described the situation and asked what the worst and best case scenarios were. Their thought was anywhere between $4 and 10k, depending on how much damage there was. Not going to happen... I trailered it to Carmax. They gave it a very thorough going over, even taking it into the shop to have several techs listen to the engine. They thought it was somewhere at the bottom of the engine and therefore "serious". Sorry for the bad news, wish we could offer more, etc. etc. Their offer was for $3,000 even, basically the top of the range of what I thought I might get. Can't complain about that too much, especially given the banged quarter panel...

Thanks again for the feedback everybody. I wish there had been a better end, but at least it's not going to scrap heap yet. I just hope whoever buys it at auction knows what they're in for!

 

[Spiegelglatt]

Curious what your replacement is. Glad to hear that at least the headache is gone and you can move on.

 

[noobytoogy]

OK, final update on this. I called a local VW specialist (they were too far to drive to before, but came highly recommended). I described the situation and asked what the worst and best case scenarios were. Their thought was anywhere between $4 and 10k, depending on how much damage there was. Not going to happen... I trailered it to Carmax. They gave it a very thorough going over, even taking it into the shop to have several techs listen to the engine. They thought it was somewhere at the bottom of the engine and therefore "serious". Sorry for the bad news, wish we could offer more, etc. etc. Their offer was for $3,000 even, basically the top of the range of what I thought I might get. Can't complain about that too much, especially given the banged quarter panel...

Thanks again for the feedback everybody. I wish there had been a better end, but at least it's not going to scrap heap yet. I just hope whoever buys it at auction knows what they're in for!

Sensible decision.

No doubt someone will tell you could have got more for the car by selling the parts but who wants a gradually dismantled clunker out on the drive?!

Enjoy your new car.

 

[kurtww]

We aren't buying a replacement quite yet, but it will likely be a 2016 Honda Pilot EX-L AWD with Sensing. The extra row in back, safety tech, lower price, and in particular the increased reliability are the deciding factors. Feels strange to not consider another VW, after having had the following in my life: 1969 Bus (dad's, bought new the year before I was born, went with us to Germany and back, and died in an engine fire about 10 years ago--didn't appreciate this one until it was too late), 1973 Squareback (my dad bought it as a second car, I never liked it), then mine: 1992 Corrado G60 (nice), 1995 Corrado SLC (nicer, literally bought off me for cash by a bank robber--that's a good story), the 2005 Touareg, and a 2006 Beetle Convertible (my wife's, just OK). There was also an Audi 80 quattro (not reliable, but I bought it with high miles), a 2000 Audi A4 (great, if small) and a 2001 TT (super fun). I've considered a new Touareg TDI but I'm just not up for issues anymore. My non-VAG cars are few and far between: 81 Lancia Beta (fun, quirky, unreliable) mid 80's Saab 900 Turbo (nice until the tranny died), and a 2003 BMW E39 M5 (hoo boy, that was fun... dangerously so, and traded for the Touareg when the first kid arrived).

Parting out the Touareg is definitely not an endeavor I'm up for!!