2010 Hybrid Touareg

lmwong · Feb 2, 2009

26.1 MPG combined! 8 spd transmission.
This just posted on Autoblog:
Volkswagen Touareg Hybrid with supercharged V6 joining BlueMotion offerings - Autoblog

nickm · Feb 2, 2009

I was wondering if the supercharged S4 engine was going to replace the 4.2L V8...I bet it does...

Nice move throwing in the hybrid. Its about time VW flexes its engineering muscle..

EARL97850 · Feb 2, 2009

I like the idea....I'm interested in the performance that goes along with 26.1 MPG in a Touareg.

Cya

nickm · Feb 2, 2009

Early reports of the new S4 are reporting performance very similar to that of the outgoing 4.2L V8...not a surprise considering the supercharged FSi V6 is supposed to put out the same power as the FSI V8 (350hp).

Very little not to like about that!...

Kevin13 · Feb 3, 2009

As long as they don't ruin the body style by making it look like a Nissan or something, they'll have a winner!

Mike's Panzer · Feb 3, 2009

Why go electric when the Diesel gets just as good mileage? I can get 24 with the V-10. The V-6 with low rolling tires should get 28.

nickm · Feb 3, 2009

Diesels make clattering noise and they smell bad (the fuel itself does), it also has cold weather issues and is not available everywhere...hybrids don't have any of these issues. Guess which one appeals to 99% of the non-auto enthusiasts out there?

Also at 374hp it makes more HP than the current V8 or V10, and at 406 ft-lbs-more torque than the V8 or V6 TDI...if the 0-100 of 6.8 is true, it'll also be faster than any Touareg to date. I believe the 26.1mpg combined will also get better mileage than any of the engines currently available. Hard to beat that combination....

enchanted egg · Feb 3, 2009

I saw an article recently that said the TDi V6 Touareg was rated 17/25, and they were getting those numbers. That would mean an average of 21 mpg. If the hybrid model gets 26 combined, that would mean its more like 22 city and 30 highway. I'm guessing of course. But those numbers are certainly appealling when you consider the GTi with the 2.0T gets that mileage, barely. Keep us posted!

canon_mutant · Feb 3, 2009

Hybrid mileage is HIGHLY subjective

Of course I have no idea exactly what VW intends to do with their application but since it is only under specific conditions when you're actually using the electric motors, mileage figures have been highly subjective and as such highly variable. I seem to recall an article about one of the SUV hybrids not getting as good of mileage as the gasser equivalent yet I'm sure if you learn how to drive it such that you maximize the usage of the electrics, your mileage will be better. And, you've got some substantial replacement costs after 8 years or so.

Diesel has none of these issues and when V10'ers are getting 23-24mpg in a vehicle that spec'd at only 20, I know the V6 TDI is going to hit 30, perhaps more. EU TDIs are hitting 35 EU mpg. Divided by 1.2 that's still impressive. And, lastly, there's the argument on how hybrid tech is going to perform off road? Of course, 99% of Americans don't buy SUVs to go off road. I happen to be in the 1% minority!

Not sure I'd be worried about the cold weather diesel issues mentioned. There's been allot of posts here about cold weather diesel performance. Don't recall any complaints.

nickm · Feb 3, 2009

Cold weather complaints are that they are down on power and LOUD when cold and unlike the V10s webasto heated interior, most take a very long time to warm up. You also have a higher risk of fuel gel vs. gas.

Careful with the EU comparisons, make sure you are not comparing US gallons to imperial gallons...my Jetta TDI gets 50MPG on an imperial gallon, which is significantly larger than a US gallon (gets around 40MPG US). If my 3000# 1.9L Jetta is getting 40mpg combined there is no way a 5500# 3.0L Treg will get 35. Most of the Aussie posts I've seen show people in the 9-10 L/100km range, which is around 23-25 US MPG. Here are the numbers from vw.de, they are consistent with the Aussie posts:

Touareg V6 TDI with DPF - Automatic
City 14,4L/100km - 16.3mpg
Highway 8,5L/100km - 27.7mpg
Combined Cycle 10,7L/100km - 22.0mpg

Jetta 1.9TDI without DPF - Manual
City 6,7L/100km - 35.1mpg
Highway 4,5L/100km - 52.3mpg
Combined Cycle 5,2L/100km - 45.2mpg

Again, I am a diesel lover and long time owner, I will own a diesel as long as they are sold... just trying to add balance to the diesel conversation...hopefully its seen as interesting and not negative. I think it would be great to see the V6 supercharged hybrid along with the V6 TDI. Both would be great choices..a more price sensitive V10 would also be a great offering (ie Sell it for $50K.)

Black Adder · Feb 3, 2009

Seems like mostly a love fest for the Hybrid, wonder how much that little love muffin will cost........

TREGinginCO · Feb 3, 2009

I would highly doubt we will see this vehicle in the United States. I would suspect that it would have a base starting price in the low to mid 50's... and I don't see many Americans (no matter how green they think they are) taking that kind of a bite ---- especially when the V6TDI will generate close to those numbers for significantly less $$$$$

EARL97850 · Feb 3, 2009

The price is probably going to be the sales killer.

Cya

canon_mutant · Feb 3, 2009

canon_mutant said:
EU TDIs are hitting 35 EU mpg. Divided by 1.2 that's still impressive.

If you would read my post, I stated 35 EU mpg. You have to divide EU mpg / 1.2 to get the equivalent U.S. mpg. That's over 29 and still very impressive in my book.

I have only heard of cold TDI diesel issues under "extreme" cold and then only involving rough idling for a minute or two.

High efficiency clean diesel, IMO, is the way of trucks and heavier SUVs. With the 25-50% increase in fuel efficiency plus being able to run B20 [yeah I know they only spec B5 but there are folks running B99 in the summer without issues] you will have a much lower carbon footprint then you're going to have with a V8 gasser hybrid without having to learn under what precise conditions you can actually expect the electrics to be engaged or you get 21 mpg instead of 26 on vehicle you probably paid an extra $10K for.

Of course, I can't get a V6 TDI, so this is probably a moot argument! ](*,)

nickm · Feb 3, 2009

canon_mutant said:
That's over 29 and still very impressive in my book.

If it gets anything better than 24-25 in the real world then that is a total success in my opinion.

canon_mutant said:
I have only heard of cold TDI diesel issues under "extreme" cold and then only involving rough idling for a minute or two.

I've owned MB and VW diesels since '91...every one I've own (which includes 4 cyl from both VW&MB as well as most recently a MB E 320 CDI ...a V6 which is very comparable to the V6 TDI) all exhibited the same traits as the thermometer dropped below 32...you need a good 10 minute run at highway speeds before they are warm and running well. If you don't live in a northern state then this is a non-issue for you.

I am not saying this as a negative, its just a reality that exists.

canon_mutant said:
Of course, I can't get a V6 TDI, so this is probably a moot argument! ](*,)

Yeah, but it keeps our days from getting boring...if nothing else VWs incompetence at releasing new models gives us something to talk about

nickm · Feb 3, 2009

TREGinginCO said:
I would highly doubt we will see this vehicle in the United States. I would suspect that it would have a base starting price in the low to mid 50's... and I don't see many Americans (no matter how green they think they are) taking that kind of a bite ---- especially when the V6TDI will generate close to those numbers for significantly less $$$$$

I would see this as being built exclusively for the US...Diesels are already established sales leaders in most other countries around the world, and most of VWs customers (myself included) are traditional diesel buyers...

Hybrid is a US phenomena, with Toyota clearly leading the way...if VW is going to commit at taking a run at Toyota (as they have stated many times) then hybrid is a path they must take. This way they keep their established customer base (with TDI) and gain new customers through hybrid...

Pricing will absolutely be a factor.

Bails · Feb 3, 2009

My understanding of the Hybrid market is that the vehicle gets best results in a stop go environment. Once the vehicle is cruising the consumption will be that of the motor. I like the hybrid idea, for me it would mean real fuel saving on my stop start driving which I do a bit of as I live near a city.

nltomba · Feb 4, 2009

Next to my V8 treg we also have a honda accord hybrid with a 240 hp V6 and an extra 15 hp from the electric motor for a total of 255 hp.
The honda is best on the highway, mostly because it turns of half its cylinders.
Wonder why the new treg will not do that.
In the winter it will take a while before the IMA kicks on. It has to do with temperatures I think.
The end of next week I will take a 1200 mile trip to Arizona with it. See what it will do.
I get close to 30 mpg on average.
If you compare this to let say a audi A6 3.0tdi I think fuel consumption will be comparable to the Honda

Bagmaker · Feb 4, 2009

I have never understood the whole turning-off-cylinders thing.
Why would that help economy? The piston/gudgeon/big end is still causing friction and heat, there is air being pumped around even if the fuel is off and the valves are open.
Can someone enlighten me or is it a gimmick for sure?

bagger

German · Feb 4, 2009

Here in Ireland your vrt (REG TAX)is lower if you buy hybrid cars and your yearly road tax is also lower which would make it very much a seller here if you can keep your co2 down, I think BMW have done this in a small way also. You must remmber the green party in Germany is very powerful not just paying lip service

Stew

2010 Hybrid Touareg

lmwong

nickm

EARL97850

nickm

Kevin13

Mike's Panzer

nickm

enchanted egg

canon_mutant

nickm

Black Adder

TREGinginCO

EARL97850

canon_mutant

nickm

nickm

Bails

nltomba

Bagmaker

German

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