Does anyone know of a source for dpf delete pipe for the 3.0 tdi?
2010 3.0 TDI DPF Delete Pipe
zagg
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I have contacted Custom Spooling, SprintLine and whole bunch of others and no one stocks a DPF delete pipe for the US 3.0 TDI. There are ones available for the European version, but only for the Audi A series that have 3.0 TDI.
Many suggest just gutting the DPF and some do not. Those that do not say that it's not that you can't, but the eddy currents of the exhaust flow in the gutted DPF will mess with the turbo and exhaust back pressure flow. Plus, by not gutting the DPF you have it just in case you need it later or what ever. Anyone have experience?
In doing a lot of research on DPFs I don't understand how some are saying that the DPF will shorten the life of the turbo. Is it really the DPF or the increased temps of the regeneration cycle that harms the turbo? I think the regeneration cycle is the cause.
If you remove the DPF I'd imagine you also need to remove the catalytic converter cause it will get clogged by soot, No?
Chime in
Many suggest just gutting the DPF and some do not. Those that do not say that it's not that you can't, but the eddy currents of the exhaust flow in the gutted DPF will mess with the turbo and exhaust back pressure flow. Plus, by not gutting the DPF you have it just in case you need it later or what ever. Anyone have experience?
In doing a lot of research on DPFs I don't understand how some are saying that the DPF will shorten the life of the turbo. Is it really the DPF or the increased temps of the regeneration cycle that harms the turbo? I think the regeneration cycle is the cause.
If you remove the DPF I'd imagine you also need to remove the catalytic converter cause it will get clogged by soot, No?
Chime in
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So I'll just keep this conversation going with myself since no one has chimed in....I went to a custom exhaust shop and the DPF delete is actually not a big problem at all. The toughest and most expensive part is making the pipe right after the turbo to the DPF, the oxidative catalyst replacement pipe.
Overall, a custom exhaust to replace everything is rather easy. The issue is finding a tuner and tune that will account for removal of everything.
Now I find myself asking myself, since no else has chimed in, is I wonder if I really need to remove the oxidative catalyst before the DPF? I wonder if it relies on the DPF regeneration cycle to keep it clean. If I remove the DPF and tune out the DPF regeneration cycle it may lead to the oxidative catalyst clogging.
I'll do some research and get back to myself.
Overall, a custom exhaust to replace everything is rather easy. The issue is finding a tuner and tune that will account for removal of everything.
Now I find myself asking myself, since no else has chimed in, is I wonder if I really need to remove the oxidative catalyst before the DPF? I wonder if it relies on the DPF regeneration cycle to keep it clean. If I remove the DPF and tune out the DPF regeneration cycle it may lead to the oxidative catalyst clogging.
I'll do some research and get back to myself.
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zagg, I am going to be contacting you soon with a few options. I am trying to gather some more information and am brain storming with a few vendors.... With all the new Audi Tdi models coming out this year, I have a feeling the DPF delete market is going to open up in the US...
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Keep the cat, it is a pass through design and is not impacted by regeneration cycles. Since the DPF is after the cat the soot is a non-issue as well since removal of the DPF will not effect the cat which is upstream in the exhaust. One idea for the DPF removal is to cut the upper cover off (which is a documented process used for cleaning them) and gut the inside. Once this is done have a pass through tube welded inside the chamber going from inlet to outlet and then weld the upper cover back on. From the outside it will look like a normal exhaust but you will have the benefits of more power and better fuel economy from the DPF removal.
You will definitely need a proper tune to support the DPF removal though.
You will definitely need a proper tune to support the DPF removal though.
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This sounds promising. I have been waiting for something like this for more power. I was going to tune my Touarge with Unitronic in the spring. Guess I will wait this out.
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Went to see the mechanic/tuner today. He took measurements and pics of exhaust and will further investigate all possibilities as far as a complete custom exhaust (I.e. straight exhaust with all cats, PDF and muffler excluded) or just a dpf delete. The main hold up is we/he need to wait to see if he himself is going to become a tuner or we'll work with a custom tuner.
It's all easily possible, but the timing and logistics of getting it done is the tricky part.
It's all easily possible, but the timing and logistics of getting it done is the tricky part.
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What tuner would he be using? I have a connection with Unitronic and maybe they can help as far as developing a Stage 2 since they already have a well established Stage 1.
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I have contacted numerous tuners and have gotten various feed back from each. I am not one to say who is better than the other and for now have made a decision to stick with one individual.
From my research on getting a custom tune with a custom exhaust the pickle is this, no one has available a tune that will take into account removal of the cats, dpf and adblue with the custom exhaust for a T2 3.0 tdi as an all in one package.
As of now I will have to go get a custom exhaust made, then take it off and put the stock back on, then get a tune to match the custom exhaust, then install the custom exhaust back on, send the ecu for the tune, install ecu and hope everything works accordingly. Or give the Treg to the mechanic for about 3 weeks to do everything at once. With the summer approaching and a lot of travel planned who knows......
I am in no rush to do this wrong and would like to have this done without giving up the vehicle for a large amount of time and/or having to change things back-n-forth a couple times.
The verdict is still out. I'm waiting on more information.
From my research on getting a custom tune with a custom exhaust the pickle is this, no one has available a tune that will take into account removal of the cats, dpf and adblue with the custom exhaust for a T2 3.0 tdi as an all in one package.
As of now I will have to go get a custom exhaust made, then take it off and put the stock back on, then get a tune to match the custom exhaust, then install the custom exhaust back on, send the ecu for the tune, install ecu and hope everything works accordingly. Or give the Treg to the mechanic for about 3 weeks to do everything at once. With the summer approaching and a lot of travel planned who knows......
I am in no rush to do this wrong and would like to have this done without giving up the vehicle for a large amount of time and/or having to change things back-n-forth a couple times.
The verdict is still out. I'm waiting on more information.
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Update......the DPF delete pipe can be done by either 1) having some one build one for you, 2) gut the DPF and insert a flow through/test pipe, or not or 3) build one yourself. JEGS exhaust has all the pieces needed if you feel capable.
A mechanic I contacted got back to me that he had talked to the tuner about a DPF delete tune. He said the tuner said that they are working on it. The tuner said that removal of the DPF on TDIs that have the urea injection system in the exhaust is problematic. In short, removal of the DPF physically and tuned out of the software without addressing the urea injection system will cause problems. It is believed the higher degree of soot reaching the 2nd cat converter and sensors will throw off the parameters in which the cat and sensors are tuned to run in. Hence, a bunch of AdBlue and exhaust codes will start being thrown. The mechanic said he believes he is experiencing this issue right now with another nonTreg TDI he did a DPF delete on. He said that vehicle keeps throwing the warning of low AdBlue, car won,t start in 450 miles, stuff like that. He said he is communications with the same tuner and they are working on it with European tuners.
Being a chemist I have had a gut feeling that, at least for the TDIs with exhaust urea injection, removal of the DPF without removing the urea injection system and 2nd cat converter will cause problems. The exhaust system of these Tregs are in sense a chemical reaction chamber tuned to take reactants and with catalysts make products. By removal of, or modification to any part of the reaction vessel will alter the efficiency and products of the reaction vessel. To ensure the reactants and catalysts are producing the desired products the reaction vessel is lined with sensors. If the sensors aren't detecting what they should be there is going to be trouble a.k.a. Fault codes. I'd also imagine that without the DPF and the urea injection still present you'd go through 3 times as much AdBlue if not more.
For those of you with a TDI and urea injection that have been tuned. I'm wondering does anyone notice that they go less miles per AdBlue fill-up. I'm averaging 10k miles per AdBlue tank with no tune.
Just my thoughts and what I've heard from the mechanic.
Has anyone else heard anything?
Will keep you updated.
A mechanic I contacted got back to me that he had talked to the tuner about a DPF delete tune. He said the tuner said that they are working on it. The tuner said that removal of the DPF on TDIs that have the urea injection system in the exhaust is problematic. In short, removal of the DPF physically and tuned out of the software without addressing the urea injection system will cause problems. It is believed the higher degree of soot reaching the 2nd cat converter and sensors will throw off the parameters in which the cat and sensors are tuned to run in. Hence, a bunch of AdBlue and exhaust codes will start being thrown. The mechanic said he believes he is experiencing this issue right now with another nonTreg TDI he did a DPF delete on. He said that vehicle keeps throwing the warning of low AdBlue, car won,t start in 450 miles, stuff like that. He said he is communications with the same tuner and they are working on it with European tuners.
Being a chemist I have had a gut feeling that, at least for the TDIs with exhaust urea injection, removal of the DPF without removing the urea injection system and 2nd cat converter will cause problems. The exhaust system of these Tregs are in sense a chemical reaction chamber tuned to take reactants and with catalysts make products. By removal of, or modification to any part of the reaction vessel will alter the efficiency and products of the reaction vessel. To ensure the reactants and catalysts are producing the desired products the reaction vessel is lined with sensors. If the sensors aren't detecting what they should be there is going to be trouble a.k.a. Fault codes. I'd also imagine that without the DPF and the urea injection still present you'd go through 3 times as much AdBlue if not more.
For those of you with a TDI and urea injection that have been tuned. I'm wondering does anyone notice that they go less miles per AdBlue fill-up. I'm averaging 10k miles per AdBlue tank with no tune.
Just my thoughts and what I've heard from the mechanic.
Has anyone else heard anything?
Will keep you updated.
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Update....This information is second hand. I in no way ensure it is 100% accurate or want to provide misinformation. I am not going to post the name of the tuner because I do not want to post that company "X" said something that I did not hear directly from their mouth or they have posted on their website.
I talked to the mechanic who does "X" companies tuning and he said company "X" is still working on the DPF removal and urea injection system issue with DPF delete. Supposedly comapny "X" has purchased a 2011+ Treg TDI and is playing with the urea injection system to see if they can tune it out. So, until they get all that figured out the mechanic said that if I get the normal Stage 2 tune and the DPF removal & urea injection delete tune comes at a later date they will only charge an additional $50 for the update plus hardware and labor.
So I'm going for a tune next week.
I talked to the mechanic who does "X" companies tuning and he said company "X" is still working on the DPF removal and urea injection system issue with DPF delete. Supposedly comapny "X" has purchased a 2011+ Treg TDI and is playing with the urea injection system to see if they can tune it out. So, until they get all that figured out the mechanic said that if I get the normal Stage 2 tune and the DPF removal & urea injection delete tune comes at a later date they will only charge an additional $50 for the update plus hardware and labor.
So I'm going for a tune next week.
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Update....I got the Treg tuned today and while at the tuner the other person who I had mentioned in my previous post that had the DPF deleted, but was having problems showed up. So I know that was true and the tuner wasn't just blowing smoke up my butt. The other guy had a Jetta TDI and yada yada yada. But it is nice to know that the tuner is working on removal of the urea injection system with DPF removal. We all talked for a while and it appears it is recognized that the are a lot of Audi 3.0 TDIs coming out (as the FourRing King had previously posted) that is fueling the development of urea injection and DPF delete tune.
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