How is it that the 2004 to 2006 2.5 litre TDi MUST use 505.01 or 506.01 oil but the same engine in the 2006 to 2009 can use 507?
R5 oil
Flash635
61 - 77 of 77 Posts
Joined
·
9,470 Posts
Not particularly, no. You've made a series of very strange posts lately and they can be comical times. I understand your desire to want to know what changed.
Joined
·
3,362 Posts
Nothing in any of the SSPs or ETKA mention any changes or even descriptions of the camshafts. I'd bet you won't find any concrete answers anywhere, short of contacting an engineer at VW directly.
You would put in whatever cam is appropriate for your engine. How do you know that the later one is "improved" ? If there was an improved one for the early engines, it would show as much in the parts catalogue. If the later cam worked in the early engine, ETKA would indicate as much. Therefore, by the power of basic deduction, it is not compatible. In an 11-year-old thread I found some speculation that the later cam has a slightly different profile for the injectors due to the DPF system and other changes, but no specifics.
You could try asking these guys and see what the difference between the cams is. Since they make two different versions, they should be able to explain why there's 2 version.
According to the latest, most current update of ETKA, the correct camshaft for your early engine is 070-109-101-P. That's it. no other option. Like it or lump it. Take it or leave it. etc.
Yes I hate when manufacturers are deliberately vague about changes. Often it is because they have stuffed up. The change to the cams can only be due to a few characteristics.
1. A change in lobe lift profile to help reduce excess wear experienced in the earlier cam or expected with the change to 507 oil as required by the introduction of the DPF
2. A change in cam material or surface treatment to improve wear resistance with the 507 oil
If you want to know exacly what changed just buy each cam from VW and take to a cam expert to measure and access. I have done that with cams for the race engines I build to assess whether the claims the various grinders make are backed up by real data. You may actually find the cams are now the same despite the different part numbers
You also need to match cam data with valve followers and PD followers to see what matching changes were made in these.
Just basic mechanical engineering which is scarce on the internet.
cheers
Rohan
1. A change in lobe lift profile to help reduce excess wear experienced in the earlier cam or expected with the change to 507 oil as required by the introduction of the DPF
2. A change in cam material or surface treatment to improve wear resistance with the 507 oil
If you want to know exacly what changed just buy each cam from VW and take to a cam expert to measure and access. I have done that with cams for the race engines I build to assess whether the claims the various grinders make are backed up by real data. You may actually find the cams are now the same despite the different part numbers
You also need to match cam data with valve followers and PD followers to see what matching changes were made in these.
Just basic mechanical engineering which is scarce on the internet.
cheers
Rohan
The ETKA I read listed 070109101M and 070109101P with no explanation.
As I mentioned earlier I used to have a good relationship with a cam designer.
I could ask him if one of these cams could be hardened but then there may be a good reason they weren't made that way in the first place.
Yes, it looks like I've asked too much of this group.
I'm used to a different level of conversation.
One time I sat with Ivan and designed a cam so that there was a burst of power available in one particular part of the track.
He designed it obviously.
t
Comical perhaps if you don't have the level of understanding.
The issue with flat followers on cams relates to galling wear. Chilled Cast iron cams with cast iron followers are resistant ot this. Steel cams with steel followers are prone to this and need special techniques to prevent it. The VW cams and followers are probably steel hence the special oil 505.01 / 506.01 initially and some other change to the design when going back to 507 oil. The analysis of the changes is not hard for the right people with the right equipment.
So far I've found using high zddp oil is working.
152,000 kms of the 302,000km on the clock.
I suppose if I had to replace the cam right now I wouldn't run up another 150,000km.
What got me started on this is I was looking at buying a 2007 with a BPE engine and it got me thinking.
152,000 kms of the 302,000km on the clock.
I suppose if I had to replace the cam right now I wouldn't run up another 150,000km.
What got me started on this is I was looking at buying a 2007 with a BPE engine and it got me thinking.
Joined
·
9,470 Posts
I hand built my first car when I was 14 years old (before the Internet could do it for me) including speccing out my own cam, heads work, intake and rocker arms, carburetor tuning etc. But I'll let you think I know nothing.
Did you know that Garrett turbos are made in China and that they make a centre cartridge.?
It wasn't hard to get a comprehensive workshop manual in those days.
I had a very good one for my Charger.
Joined
·
9,470 Posts
Unfortunately you are incorrect. Garrett does not offer a center cartridge. Garrett offers replacement turbochargers. Link me one of these supposed Garrett center housing rotating assemblies 😏
Yes there were lots of manuals those days, I think I had a Hanes and I can't remember the other one
Joined
·
3,362 Posts
Hanes? 🤣 might as well have asked @Wagon8ter to guide you.
Joined
·
9,470 Posts
Wait, you spelled @meanyhead wrong
Joined
·
201 Posts
Don't get the reference but I feel like I should be insulted regardless
Joined
·
9,470 Posts
🤣 🤣 🤣
61 - 77 of 77 Posts
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
