Had some fun today just outside Melbourne
Regards
Kevin
Regards
Kevin
A Sunday Drive
clipper_from_oz
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I have recently had the same issue with the ESP dropping out on a very steep (and very big) hill.. got nearly all the way to the top and skipped a bit on rocks then...... nothing... then wheel spin and go no where...
Will actually go back and try it without diff lock to see if that makes much difference, but a bit of a pain.
Here is a pic from a smaller hill (not far from Werribee), sitting with hill ascent and no brakes... mobile phone shot so pls excuse the quality.
Will actually go back and try it without diff lock to see if that makes much difference, but a bit of a pain.
Here is a pic from a smaller hill (not far from Werribee), sitting with hill ascent and no brakes... mobile phone shot so pls excuse the quality.
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I wouldn't have thought you would do better without the center diff engaged, but correct me if I'm wrong. On the dial you have a choice of 'auto diff' or lock, which makes me think the car probably decides to engage the center diff at some point, regardless of whether you lock it.
kalmsg, you did switch the ESP off, or into Slippery mode as we've taken to calling it? Also bear in mind that some of those threads are talking about petrol engines rather than diesel. I casually noticed the TDv6 touareg likes to change gears by 2000rpm (please don't quote me), so 4500 sounds like a lot for a diesel engine.
kalmsg, you did switch the ESP off, or into Slippery mode as we've taken to calling it? Also bear in mind that some of those threads are talking about petrol engines rather than diesel. I casually noticed the TDv6 touareg likes to change gears by 2000rpm (please don't quote me), so 4500 sounds like a lot for a diesel engine.
I would have thought it would be better with diff locked and that is why I had gone with it locked however perhaps it may have been better if the car had been able to allocate power around... I dont know.
Point taken on the revs but the same thing must happen at some point, I was in 1st gear and it just stopped.
The hill was very big, similar angle to the Werribee ones but taller and a bit rougher at the top.
Point taken on the revs but the same thing must happen at some point, I was in 1st gear and it just stopped.
The hill was very big, similar angle to the Werribee ones but taller and a bit rougher at the top.
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Guys
Here's my experience with ESP and the centre difflock.
Firstly, the auto difflock in my view isn't really locking any diffs. What's happening is that when one wheel loses traction thereby getting all the power, the ESP/ABS etc detects the slip and starts to apply braking effort, which in effect stops the slipping wheel from turning and thereby driving the wheel still in contact with the ground. You see this to best effect when your vehicle is cross axling. See photo. The system also makes a fair bit of noise as the brakes are applied and released. Even if you're not cross-axling, there will always be moments where you lose some traction on steep descents and you'll hear slipping etc. The trick is to believe in the car and take your time. In my view, you'll always quit before the car needs to.
Secondly, locking the centre diff from the console locks up the drive train so that power is delivered evenly to the front and rear diffs. I've found this most useful in muddy/slippery/clay conditions where you need to keep going. One thing to be mindful of is that with the centre difflock engaged, it's a fair bit more difficult to steer, so pick your moments.
Basically, engines and drive trains are lazy and will always take the path of least resistance. The diff locks, both auto and selective try to overcome this. If you're in any doubt, select centre difflock early. Both times I had to be snatched, was because I hadn't selected the centre difflock early enough.
Cheers
Here's my experience with ESP and the centre difflock.
Firstly, the auto difflock in my view isn't really locking any diffs. What's happening is that when one wheel loses traction thereby getting all the power, the ESP/ABS etc detects the slip and starts to apply braking effort, which in effect stops the slipping wheel from turning and thereby driving the wheel still in contact with the ground. You see this to best effect when your vehicle is cross axling. See photo. The system also makes a fair bit of noise as the brakes are applied and released. Even if you're not cross-axling, there will always be moments where you lose some traction on steep descents and you'll hear slipping etc. The trick is to believe in the car and take your time. In my view, you'll always quit before the car needs to.
Secondly, locking the centre diff from the console locks up the drive train so that power is delivered evenly to the front and rear diffs. I've found this most useful in muddy/slippery/clay conditions where you need to keep going. One thing to be mindful of is that with the centre difflock engaged, it's a fair bit more difficult to steer, so pick your moments.
Basically, engines and drive trains are lazy and will always take the path of least resistance. The diff locks, both auto and selective try to overcome this. If you're in any doubt, select centre difflock early. Both times I had to be snatched, was because I hadn't selected the centre difflock early enough.
Cheers
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i've always taken the very steep sections/hills quite slowly, with the centre diff locked and have been able to get where some modified fourbys couldnt.
in some real tough n slippery conditions the rear diff lock was helpful
in some real tough n slippery conditions the rear diff lock was helpful
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We went on a new Sunday drive this weekend to Toolangi state forest with the Range Rover club. The touareg performed brilliantly, if I were to criticize anything, it would be that we probably had the lowest clearance angles of the group.
Conditions were steep, slippery, rocky and muddy
I drove up a very steep track in low range but without engaging the center diff. A toyota troopy got stuck on this same climb and needed a bit of assistance to reach the top. I would have engaged centre diff, but had been driving without it on the gentler parts to see if I could notice a difference. I didn't notice a difference, but I still believe there might be. I've now decided that since I have it, I'll use it.
We did a long slippery descent where every vehicle except the touareg reported doing at least part of the track sideways. This was probably the most terrifying thing I've done in the Touareg to date. Bit like Bobz says, you trust in the vehicle and quit before it does. So I engaged hill descent and kept my feet above the brake and accelerator in case I had to start driving through the breaks.
Lots of clicking, whirring and a noise like scraping across rocks (which we weren't). The touareg did loose traction once or twice, and we slid forward down the ruts in one particular section, but we stayed facing forwards and for the most part in control.
I had previously thought the hill descent might be a little slow. I don't think so any more. Another vehicle (Patrol I think) got stuck in a spoon drain on the same section and had to be winched free. The touaregs traction control takes the credit here. I can't take credit for any driving skills.
I am very impressed with the on and off road capabilities of my Touareg.
I might add that we were warm and comfortable throughout the 8 'til 8 driving day.
Conditions were steep, slippery, rocky and muddy
I drove up a very steep track in low range but without engaging the center diff. A toyota troopy got stuck on this same climb and needed a bit of assistance to reach the top. I would have engaged centre diff, but had been driving without it on the gentler parts to see if I could notice a difference. I didn't notice a difference, but I still believe there might be. I've now decided that since I have it, I'll use it.
We did a long slippery descent where every vehicle except the touareg reported doing at least part of the track sideways. This was probably the most terrifying thing I've done in the Touareg to date. Bit like Bobz says, you trust in the vehicle and quit before it does. So I engaged hill descent and kept my feet above the brake and accelerator in case I had to start driving through the breaks.
Lots of clicking, whirring and a noise like scraping across rocks (which we weren't). The touareg did loose traction once or twice, and we slid forward down the ruts in one particular section, but we stayed facing forwards and for the most part in control.
I had previously thought the hill descent might be a little slow. I don't think so any more. Another vehicle (Patrol I think) got stuck in a spoon drain on the same section and had to be winched free. The touaregs traction control takes the credit here. I can't take credit for any driving skills.
I am very impressed with the on and off road capabilities of my Touareg.
I might add that we were warm and comfortable throughout the 8 'til 8 driving day.
David, I've had the same terrifying experience on slippery descents. the only way to get out if it in one piece was to not touch the brakes but accellerate thru it ....despite the bend at the bottom....i think only better tyres can help here...
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Singh, I think you're spot on with the tyres. I hope you can find something suitable for the v10 with it's big rims. I was very happy with the Pirelli Scorpions. I think AT tyres are probably one of the best general improvements you can make if you want to go off road. The RR Sport on the trip had road tyres, less grip and less resistance to damage.
Our trip leader's instructions for descending a steep hill like this was to drive through the breaks, meaning have a light pressure on the breaks with the left foot, whilst accelerating with the right.
I chose to rely on the Touareg's hill descent feature. ie. Put it in low first gear, then wait until the car starts creeping forward under it's own power. I did touch the accelerator, canceling hill descent when I'd almost reached the bottom, thinking the worst was over. This cause a little bit of sliding, and I quickly re-engaged it.
I'm extremely impressed with the hill descent feature.
A word of warning though. If you want to use hill descent, engage it on the flat, before you go over the lip of the slope. It will engage on a slope, but lunges forward, when you take you foot off the break, before the hill descent engages. This is an unpleasant feeling.
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When you say "engage" hill descent control, I take it you mean you just set up the conditions: ie LOW RANGE, < 20km/hr, pointing down hill with no accelerator or brake...
So you "engage" it before you need it by taking foot off accelerator / brake before the hill becomes steep, and it will maintain whatever speed you are doing at that point?
Or have I got it wrong and there is an "engage descent control" button somewhere??
..Neil
So you "engage" it before you need it by taking foot off accelerator / brake before the hill becomes steep, and it will maintain whatever speed you are doing at that point?
Or have I got it wrong and there is an "engage descent control" button somewhere??
..Neil
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Hm correct sort of, there is no special button except, you need to select manual, that is you pull the lever towards you (to the right and pull it backward to - as it usually starts in second low) to get it into low range first. The LCD screen in your dash bottom shows you what gear your in, then let it roll forward slowly.When you say "engage" hill descent control, I take it you mean you just set up the conditions: ie LOW RANGE, < 20km/hr, pointing down hill with no accelerator or brake...
So you "engage" it before you need it by taking foot off accelerator / brake before the hill becomes steep, and it will maintain whatever speed you are doing at that point?
Or have I got it wrong and there is an "engage descent control" button somewhere??
..Neil
M
downhill
I had pirelli scorpion at's on the v6 and they did well but in reall muddy/clay conditions the grooves fill up easily and I was just rolling on four balls!
I am contemplating putting on 18 inch rims with a set of coopers or goodyear MTRs on the standard 19 rim. see the pic..
as for hill descent its awesome, in low range move to first gear point downhill and do not accelerate...on a slippery downhill its another story!!!
I had pirelli scorpion at's on the v6 and they did well but in reall muddy/clay conditions the grooves fill up easily and I was just rolling on four balls!
I am contemplating putting on 18 inch rims with a set of coopers or goodyear MTRs on the standard 19 rim. see the pic..
as for hill descent its awesome, in low range move to first gear point downhill and do not accelerate...on a slippery downhill its another story!!!
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Hi Singh,
MTR might be a bit over the top and noisy, unless of course you'r only going to use them in the dirt;
Markus
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I think Sumar answered this pretty well in his reply.When you say "engage" hill descent control, I take it you mean you just set up the conditions: ie LOW RANGE, < 20km/hr, pointing down hill with no accelerator or brake...
So you "engage" it before you need it by taking foot off accelerator / brake before the hill becomes steep, and it will maintain whatever speed you are doing at that point?
Or have I got it wrong and there is an "engage descent control" button somewhere??
..Neil
There is no button, you engage hill descent by setting the conditons, and it is a little like cruise control from the point of view that it disengages if you try something manual with the brake or accelerator.
Unlike cruise control, hill descent operates at a low speed. Which is probably close to walking speed. As I said before, I felt it was a bit too slow, but now I've experienced a steep and slippery track, think it's probably just right. If you try it on a moderate slope, then it will work, but effectively just be using engine breaking with the low gear at idle revs. If it's steeper, the ABS starts stopping individual wheels, and it makes quite a racket.
I don't mean to sound like a broken record, but I really think joining a 4wd club, doing the driver training and trying these things in a supervised and supported way is a fantastic way to learn.
If you look carefully at the bottom left of our back window, you'll see "Lurch" is sporting a new club touareg sticker, courtesy of Ozvino
Very cool.Attachments
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665 Posts
Thanks for the explanations of how the "Downhill Driving Assistant" works.
Sumar, I did not think that the gear mattered, as long as it was in LOW - and as my manual says "a gear has been selected" (which I have always taken to mean TIPTRONIC ie pull stick to right from D). So it could be LOW 1 or LOW 2 for a start.
DMM_AU, I haven't thought it too slow, as I believe that as long as you are under 20km/hr and going down hill in LOW range and have manually selected a gear (and are not using the accelerator), it is engaged and on-call for any slip detected.
My own experience of using it has been limited to "testing" it on a loose gravelly slope, and IIRC I was doing 10-15k, in 2nd LOW. It wasn't working hard, but noticably gripping a wheel now and then. I think it tries to hold the speed you were doing when it detected the need to act and prevent it running away.
As you say, joining a 4WD club is a good thing, as you get to practice in all sorts of conditions. I have often wondered if we should set up a training day under the ClubTouareg umbrella where we get a professional organisation to provide a trainer for the day...
..Neil
Sumar, I did not think that the gear mattered, as long as it was in LOW - and as my manual says "a gear has been selected" (which I have always taken to mean TIPTRONIC ie pull stick to right from D). So it could be LOW 1 or LOW 2 for a start.
DMM_AU, I haven't thought it too slow, as I believe that as long as you are under 20km/hr and going down hill in LOW range and have manually selected a gear (and are not using the accelerator), it is engaged and on-call for any slip detected.
My own experience of using it has been limited to "testing" it on a loose gravelly slope, and IIRC I was doing 10-15k, in 2nd LOW. It wasn't working hard, but noticably gripping a wheel now and then. I think it tries to hold the speed you were doing when it detected the need to act and prevent it running away.
As you say, joining a 4WD club is a good thing, as you get to practice in all sorts of conditions. I have often wondered if we should set up a training day under the ClubTouareg umbrella where we get a professional organisation to provide a trainer for the day...
..Neil
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The usual rules are,(as I learnt them) second gear lowe for uphill and water crosssing, down hill, low first. Second low is usually to fast, that is the chance to loose control to easy, ones the car starts slipping or running away it will be to late to take back control and very often you want all the time to stay on yor chosen line.
Markus
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If someone has a manual handy, we could settle this I think.
I've found low second doesn't provide enough engine breaking for slopes and does run away a bit. Low first is good, but again I feel it speeds up, unless I have stopped, engage low 1st, and let the car start forward at it's own pace.
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