[JMGTreg14]

Yeah, they totally and hilariously look alike at this point. Here is a Ravian for reference:

View attachment 250631

I suppose at least The Ravian isn’t that ugly of a truck (I can’t stand the headlights personally). Also figure the final version could look completely different as this is supposedly to be designed by USA for USA. That brings me to a 2026 production date being pretty difficult to hit it would seem-unless something in some form exists already.

I thought the same thing about the Rivian headlights…until I saw it in person. The truck in the wild looks great and the headlights aren’t off-putting like they can be in photos. I have a neighbor who owns one (in the green color) and I can’t help but state at it longingly every time he drives by.

If VW can create a knock-off version with the new Scout, and come in at a lower price, it will be on my list - not to replace my TDI Touareg, but would ditch my wife’s Q5 Supercharged in a heartbeat,

 

[JMGTreg14]

I am opened minded to EV because it is easier on my psychologically (because otherwise it is harder to take). I believe the ICE is far from being dead, but that regulations (and specially people elected) are making choices for us a a whole that is more or less getting rid of ICE in an “accelerated” manner. Then on a global scale we have China mandating a large portion of their vehicles be BEV as well as Europe. In the US, some states (some even being 100% by some date) are mandating this too.

For the record I don’t agree with this approach and feel people should vote with their wallets on what sells and doesn’t. I do think EV has certain advantages (charging at home and around city use being two). But I agree, making something for rural use that doesn’t have a range extender is pretty… naïve. To make something to tow with that is BEV is even more so. I recently read a motor trend article of the Ford F150 Lightening only being able to tow a trailer the size I have 90 miles??? Clearly a range extender is needed.

I do think battery tech will improve and get better, but I think until it does no group of people that were miseducated should be making these macro decisions that impact folks. I mean aside from above, what do you do in a power out? What do you do in the middle of the woods? Seriously?

I joined the forum I mentioned and voices these concerns…many others have too but have not received feedback from Scout yet. I do think from reading the forum that they intend the Scout to be robust and a serious off-roading…just heavy (batteries are heavy) and don’t seem to be addressing the range issue me and others are mentioning.

I don’t understand where people are getting this idea that politicians are forcing car companies to switch to producing electric vehicles. That’s just not how car manufacturers, or government, works. The reason every car company has an end-date for ICE powered vehicles, is that building electric takes less parts, requires fewer workers to assemble and has less maintenance issues long-term. Then add to it, the fact that it’s providing a potential way out of their decades-old dealership agreements and it’s easy to understand why they’re making the switch. Sure, every government has a say in how much pollutants vehicles can emit and that’s not doing IC engines any favors, but to complain about that being a negative is self defeating, unless you want to breath more air pollution.

Another thing to keep in mind, especially when you may not be able to see what the future holds for battery life, range, the power grid, charging stations, etc., is that in the past 25 years, we’ve gone from no cell phones, to bag phones, to brick phone with 1 hour batteries, to smartphones with a couple of hours of battery life to now full blown mini computer phones that have all-day battery life. And early on, the cell coverage was spotty at best, and in many areas of the country (and globally) there was no cell service. I can also add the fact that cell phones back in the early days were EXPENSIVE as was the cost to make calls. I remember signing a contract where I was paying both a per minute charge and a per call charge and might have had 100 minutes of calls included, which I gladly paid because I was on the road for work and it was easier to be connected than to have to keep stopping at gas stations to use a phone booth.

But today, you can stream live tv, or download full movies in minutes on 5G. In other words, the shift to EV’s and all the things that will support it will happen at an accelerated pace once we get past the tipping point of enough companies selling EV’s / enough people buying EV’s.

Many people don’t even realize how far we‘ve come in such a short time and the exact thing will happen with EV’s. Once an automaker gets the process down for cranking out EV’s, they’ll drop ICE vehicle production and save themselves billions of dollars in production and people costs.

 

[JMGTreg14]

@JMGTreg14

I had to do a major edit…my iPhone was totally freaking out and messed up my post too much.

CARB in the US is the reason why people see this as a government mandate. CARB stipulates that by 2035 all light duty cars and trucks have to be either BEV or plug in. There is legislation in other states that are following CARB’s initiatives.

BEV does have fewer parts, and maintenance is easy. You can charge at home. Have a warm or cool car when you are ready to go if you are plugged in and have instant, smooth power.

The growing pains will be harder for some with battery tech. At present one cannot RV across the US with a BEV. I posted above and on the Scout forum about a motor trend article that mentioned the F150 lightening could only do 90 miles with my trailer. That doest work for many folks. We talk about this as RVers with other folks at the parks…they feel they will never own a BEV pickup because it simply wouldn’t work.

Please understand that I am more pro EV than most people I know. I too see this as the future-but battery tech has to catch up and it doesn’t seem too promising for towing anytime soon. A proper tow vehicle should tow like tow a 7,500 lbs trailer 250+miles between fill ups or 800 miles is a 14 hour period.

So I see what you are saying. I am excited about EV’s. I just wouldn’t be able to use one to do what I can right now with my old Treg that has well over 100k miles on it.

I am excited for the Scout brand because I think this is the smartest move by VAG since the original Beetle. I want to see Scout succeed and wish there was a way range wasn’t an issue like the range extending idea I posted over on their forum for a plug for wiring prep to be done and software to be coded allowing to charge while driving. A (yes gas) generator that could be plugged in. Scout wouldn’t need to provide the generator, just the prep for one (plug, exhaust coupler, and intake / ventilation.

Another idea I had was they batteries could be leased separately so as they could traded for new tech in the futures. Granted I am not an engineer, just a business banker-but it seems like a really good risk mitigation that would broaden the audience of potential buyers while also generating more future revenues that people would actually want to spend.

One thing I wanted to comment on that may help in understanding where we are today vs what the future will hold for EV’s goes back to my comment about smart phones. When cell phones first came out, they either offered very little usable battery life, or none in the case of bag phones. They also didn’t provide connection to the web (not that there was a usable web back then) or apps or NFC banking, etc. And the same kinds of comments were made back then about the fact that they cost too much, didn’t offer a good user experience, couldn’t replace our wired home phones.

For some reason, there seems to be this idea that EV’s today should be able to do everything ICE powered vehicles have had 100 years to get to the point they’re at now, which just isn’t how things work with vehicles or any product. Returning to ICE vehicle development, 40 years ago we had V8 engines that developed less than 200 hp, and offered single digit gas mileage and today we can buy a V8 that makes 500+ hp and gets 25 mpg on the highway. The same thing is going to happen with EVs, whether that’s with battery technology, charging speed and the charging infrastructure. You can’t go from effectively zero to a fully formed and developed EV world overnight.

And as far as CARB goes, please keep in mind that there is not an unlimited amount of breathable air, drinkable water, farmable land, etc. Any process that burns fossil fuels is much like peeing in your drinking water. We can’t keep doing what we’ve done for the past 200 years, if we want to have a livable planet for our kids and their kids. Even with the CARB rule, we’re still going to have ICE powered vehicles on the market for at least the next 30 to 50 years, as it will take time for EV’s to replace all vehicles. But again, we have to start somewhere and I would be willing to bet big money that we’ll look back in 20 years and wonder why it took us so long to make the shift to EV’s and a sustainable energy world.