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Discussion Starter #1
Any interest in a 1 micron fuel filter assembly that would replace the factory fuel filter head/ filter with a new one that uses a 1 micron fuel filter?

Prices would be around $150 for the complete assembly with a 1 micron filter.

Extra filters would be around $40-45.

The filters are rated for ~100,000 miles, but it may not be a bad idea to change every 50k or so IMHO
 

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I am adding a MANN Preline Filter system in mine. It's being placed before the factory filter. 1 micron is too small in my opinion. I think factory is around 5+/- Micron (not really sure since MANN and others do not post microns for filters). Preline is around 10 micron which is good for a pre-filter. There are different micron filters and functions but it also removes water. OEM removes water too but not as easily as the preline filters do.

100K miles on a 1 micron filter is not a good idea neither is 50K miles. The filter for me is only in-case I fill up at a regular gas station. Normally I fill up at stations that have 20-30micron filters on their fuel pumps. I have a card with Pacific Pride network, they filter all their diesel fuel.



I went with MANN because they are OEM. It has a multigrade filter and it well made. I have not got it in yet from Germany but should be in in a week or so.

Again my main reason to add this is it only takes 1 table spoon of debris to clog a filter and although I have never had anything in my fuel filter canister, I am not taking a chance on it with a regular gas station who may not or typically does not take care of their tanks or pumps. I think a 1 micron for a main is not a good idea. It might be ok for after filter from the main OEM filter but even then 1 micron will clog quickly. lowest I would go for an after filter from MAIN is 5 microns.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I am adding a MANN Preline Filter system in mine. It's being placed before the factory filter. 1 micron is too small in my opinion. I think factory is around 5+/- Micron (not really sure since MANN and others do not post microns for filters). Preline is around 10 micron which is good for a pre-filter. There are different micron filters and functions but it also removes water. OEM removes water too but not as easily as the preline filters do.

100K miles on a 1 micron filter is not a good idea neither is 50K miles. The filter for me is only in-case I fill up at a regular gas station. Normally I fill up at stations that have 20-30micron filters on their fuel pumps. I have a card with Pacific Pride network, they filter all their diesel fuel.



I went with MANN because they are OEM. It has a multigrade filter and it well made. I have not got it in yet from Germany but should be in in a week or so.

Again my main reason to add this is it only takes 1 table spoon of debris to clog a filter and although I have never had anything in my fuel filter canister, I am not taking a chance on it with a regular gas station who may not or typically does not take care of their tanks or pumps. I think a 1 micron for a main is not a good idea. It might be ok for after filter from the main OEM filter but even then 1 micron will clog quickly. lowest I would go for an after filter from MAIN is 5 microns.
Thank you for your opinion, but I respectfully disagree, especially since you don't know what filter I am talking about and it's filter capabilities.

IMHO you can get small enough for a main filter ( i could quote a bunch of different sources for my reasoning, but this one sums its up, as does the paper in this link)
"fuel system performance.

It must be extremely precise in terms of quantity, distribution and timing. Ball seat valves are sealed with balls that are only 1mm in diameter. A good seal is absolutely necessary for proper injection. Damage from erosive wear, such as shown below, will cause over fueling, leading to decreased fuel efficiency and eventually shut you down altogether.

hpcr injector damaged by hard particulate(3) high-pressure-fuel-system-wear
Pump performance can also be compromised by scoring and abrasive wear. These issues are magnified by the tighter tolerances and extreme pressures in HPCR engines. In these circumstances, it is the smallest particles (1-5 microns in size)
that cause the most damage, virtually sand blasting part surfaces."

https://www.stle.org/images/pdf/STLE_ORG/AM2017 Presentations/Power Generation/STLE2017_Power Generation I_Session 7F_N. Achebe_Dirt A Lethal Diesel Fuel Contaminant.pdf

Seeing how many many Duramax (including myself), Cummins, and even Powerstroke people have been running this same filter or the slightly smaller 2 micron Cat filter on their trucks for years and some going by the recommended 100,000 mile change interval I don't see where your reasoning comes in.

The fuel injectors are typically have clearance tolerances in the 1 micron level, so obviously it wouldn't take much to start abrading the ball seat in the injectors, not to mention how teeny tiny the injector orifices are again it would take much to clog one up :grin2:
 

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Ok.

Not really my opinion more so what I have gathered over the years of research. All I was stating is what I was doing. No need to get snarky! 1 micron is 1 micron so brand does not matter much. Racor, Niktane (which I assume your talking about) and others make them. Not anything foreign here. I have done the research and have taken a few classes on this stuff at the overland expo here in Flagstaff 3 years in a row. I'd prefer to have 2 filters vs one filter at 1 micron and make sure to buy diesel from stations with filters on pumps. Like I said, 1 tablespoon of debris can clog a OEM filter. With a high pressure fuel system, I'd rather keep the OEM @10µm+/- with a lower micron or similar to OEM µm after. I'd do the primary and a 1 micron after. Don't forget 10µm can filter out 1 micron particles. That all said, really the water removal is whats crucial here. That is what kills the pumps and injectors. I could go on but I can tell that it won't go anywhere. I'd also like to know who funded the study you supplied? Anyway, I can see a 1 micron used in tandem with OEM as an after filter but not as a main filter. Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Ok.

Not really my opinion more so what I have gathered over the years of research. All I was stating is what I was doing. No need to get snarky! 1 micron is 1 micron so brand does not matter much. Racor, Niktane (which I assume your talking about) and others make them. Not anything foreign here. I have done the research and have taken a few classes on this stuff at the overland expo here in Flagstaff 3 years in a row. I'd prefer to have 2 filters vs one filter at 1 micron and make sure to buy diesel from stations with filters on pumps. Like I said, 1 tablespoon of debris can clog a OEM filter. With a high pressure fuel system, I'd rather keep the OEM @10µm+/- with a lower micron or similar to OEM µm after. I'd do the primary and a 1 micron after. I could go on but I can tell that it won't go anywhere. I'd also like to know who funded the study you supplied? Anyway, I can see a 1 micron used in tandem with OEM as an after filter but not as a main filter. Good luck.
Sorry did not mean to come off as Snarky, hence why I said I respecfully disagree.

I do agree on that the ultimate system would be to have the factory filter in place, and the 1 micron filter afterwards, but I don't think that there is room in the engine bay for such a setup. So instead of that I am choosing to use the 1 micron exclusively and just replace the filter more. :grin2:
I'd like to keep my diesel fuel as clean as possible since the injectors are expensive and a PITA to replace :wink2:
 

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Sorry did not mean to come off as Snarky, hence why I said I respecfully disagree.

I do agree on that the ultimate system would be to have the factory filter in place, and the 1 micron filter afterwards, but I don't think that there is room in the engine bay for such a setup. So instead of that I am choosing to use the 1 micron exclusively and just replace the filter more. :grin2:
I'd like to keep my diesel fuel as clean as possible since the injectors are expensive and a PITA to replace :wink2:
There is room. Another member is using a fuel manager system in tandem with the OEM filter. That's the way to do it. They do this a lot in Australia, using a 30µm pre and then OEM primary or OEM and 5µm after. I have contacted about 5 specialist there about this as as well as 2 in Germany. Conclusion I have found is Keep the OEM primary and run a pre or after filter. 1µm filter as primary could be an issue. I would not worry about the injectors. Those are cheap compared to a HPFP and the complete fuel system being destroyed by a clogged filter. If OEM thought a 1 micron would suffice they would have used one. I believe OEM is <10µm. Even using regular stations in the past has never clogged a filter nor have I found particles in canister but fuel is dirty and filter is dirty after 10K miles when I change my filter. I change it between 8-10K miles. Cheaper insurance than paying $8K for a new fuel system. Also do you know the flow rates of the filter you are using?
 

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Discussion Starter #7
There is room. Another member is using a fuel manager system in tandem with the OEM filter. That's the way to do it. They do this a lot in Australia, using a 30µm pre and then OEM primary or OEM and 5µm after. I have contacted about 5 specialist there about this as as well as 2 in Germany. Conclusion I have found is Keep the OEM primary and run a pre or after filter. 1µm filter as primary could be an issue. I would not worry about the injectors. Those are cheap compared to a HPFP and the complete fuel system being destroyed by a clogged filter. If OEM thought a 1 micron would suffice they would have used one. I believe OEM is <10µm. Even using regular stations in the past has never clogged a filter nor have I found particles in canister but fuel is dirty and filter is dirty after 10K miles when I change my filter. I change it between 8-10K miles. Cheaper insurance than paying $8K for a new fuel system. Also do you know the flow rates of the filter you are using?
I do have the specs on it, here you are sir :)
I will try and shoe horn this in with the factory setup, thanks for the tip

Up to 25 gpm (94.6 lpm) maximum flow
50 psi (3.4 bar) maximum working pressure
Various micron media(s) available
Microglass filters have a higher dirt-holding capacity for longer life
Filters are UL recognized for use in fuel dispensers
 

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Discussion Starter #10
After researching more and more about microglass fiters I can see why they have a 100,000 mile change interval.

They can hold many many more times the amounts of dirt than normal media fuel filters.

I am going to eliminate my original fuel filter and just run this 1 micron fuel filter.

I am very confident that it will do a great job, better that the factory media filter at filtering everything without a huge pressure drop.

As a matter of fact these filters are designed to be used on commercial fuel pumps as well. So you can just imagine how many gallons that they can filter before needing replacement.

Just some of the articles that I found:
http://www.kaydonfiltration.com/docs/default-source/default-document-library/filter-media---fiberglass-vs-cellulose.pdf

http://baldwinfilters.com/literature/english/10 TSB's/09-1.pdf

http://www.emea.donaldson.com/fr/ih/support/datalibrary/037008.pdf
 

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I am going to eliminate my original fuel filter and just run this 1 micron fuel filter.

I am very confident that it will do a great job, better that the factory media filter at filtering everything without a huge pressure drop.

As a matter of fact these filters are designed to be used on commercial fuel pumps as well. So you can just imagine how many gallons that they can filter before needing replacement.

I'm sorry but what you are saying above goes contrary to my understanding of filter performance and micron size.


A 1 micron filter will supposively trap any particles of 1 micron or larger so logically a 10 micron (say) filter will filter anything larger than 10 microns, so is it not logical that a 1 micron will catch more particles than a 10 micron one and will clog up faster and need replacing sooner than a 10 micron filter??
Is it not also logical that there would be a bigger restriction to flow (read pressure drop) by using 1 micron to using 10 micron when all other things between the two filters are the same i.e. physical size of filter size and media material.


Please convince me otherwise.


TonyB
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I'm sorry but what you are saying above goes contrary to my understanding of filter performance and micron size.


A 1 micron filter will supposively trap any particles of 1 micron or larger so logically a 10 micron (say) filter will filter anything larger than 10 microns, so is it not logical that a 1 micron will catch more particles than a 10 micron one and will clog up faster and need replacing sooner than a 10 micron filter??
Is it not also logical that there would be a bigger restriction to flow (read pressure drop) by using 1 micron to using 10 micron when all other things between the two filters are the same i.e. physical size of filter size and media material.


Please convince me otherwise.


TonyB
I am only repeating what I was told and confirmed through my research.

Did you click on any of the links above?

The synthetic media is the same that GM (donaldson)/ Amsoil and a bunch of companies have been using for a long time. This is why amsoil Ea oil filters can be run for 15 or 25,000 miles and are still effective.

Believe what you want, I am moving forward :wink2:
 

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Most manufacturers use a 2-10 micron filter anyway. I'd say the stock fuel filter is close to a 4-8 micron. I see no issues with a 1 micron but if I were buying another fuel filter at 1 micron, I'd run it in tandem with the OEM being the main and 1 micron as secondary. That way you have 2 defenses. Most diesel trucks or commercial vehicles have 2 filters of different micron ratings. That combined with using as much as possible, filtered fuel at stations and you should have zero issues if filters changed in appropriate frequency.

A primary filter is used to remove the bulk of free water and contaminants and thus protect the transfer pump (if present) and secondary filter. Typical primary filter efficiency is 95% to 98% @ =10 micron. A secondary filter is the second filter in a two filter system. It is located between the primary filter and the fuel injection system, often after a transfer pump. Typical secondary filter efficiency is 95% to 98% @ = 3 to 10 microns. Newer high pressure fuel injection systems require removal of the smallest measurable hard particles.The main advantage of a two filter system over a single filter system is that much of the dissolved asphaltenes present in diesel fuel are caught by the primary filter, leaving the secondary filter relatively clean and ready to remove free water and fine particles. A properly sized two filter system will often outlast and outperform a similarly rated single fuel filter system.

Asphaltenes are tarry, organic particles that naturally occur in #2 diesel fuels. Asphaltene particles are generally thought to be in the one-half to 2 micron range and are harmless to the injection system, as they are soft and deformable. Concentrations of asphaltenes in diesel fuel vary widely and can increase through heat and fuel oxidation. As these tiny particles pass through the filter media they tend to stick to individual fibers. A build up of asphaltenes is the normal mechanism that plugs diesel fuel filters, not hard particles.

Source: Today's Trucking

He's going to do what he wants regardless but I don't recommend removing OEM filter for a 1 micron. I'd rather have tandem filter like V10's had. It's more logical and like I said most heavy trucks, commercial trucks and equipment have 2 fuel filters in tandem for the best filtering as those engines and components are 10 times the cost of the Touareg's.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Most medium duty/ heavy duty trucks run a single filter as we do.
Cummins, Powerstroke, Duramax.

Guys add lift pumps sometimes with additional filters for extra protection.

Most of those guys also either eliminate the factory filter, or go to a 1 or 2 micron filter for as you said extra protection.

This is old school thinking though because people are used to the media filters that get clogged from a relatively little amount of dirt because of their design. It would be like running 2 oil filters on your Touareg one normal oil filter, and a new synthetic media filter. When in reality you could just run one the synthetic one which would still remove all of the particles that it is designed to filter and the larger ones to boot without loosing effectiveness.

Think of having a piece of cardboard that traps tennis ball size particles. Once 50% of the whole are clogged with something larger than a tennis ball it is 50% clogged.

Now think of a web of fiberglass where all of the strands can catch tennis balls size particles or larger. It takes much more particulate than to clog it to the same degree as a media filter because it does it more on a 3d level versus just a layer of pass through material like the media.
That a horrible explanation, but the best I can do in laymans terms.

Asphaltenes are also what cause injectors to gum up and stick over time, and why companies now offer products to help eliminate the stiction. I personally would rather filter them out before that happens.

GM went to the synthetic media in their trucks because they saw the benefit in it.

It take vehicle manufacturers a long time to catch up to new technology, the lawn mower manufacturers are even worse :p

I bet in another 5-10 years you will see more vehicle manufacturers moving toward synthetic media as it gains popularity and is needed now that even most gasoline engines are direct injected.

Being an Amsoil dealer and reading all of the information that they had available when their synthetic oil and air filters became available is enough for me.

Don't worry i'll be posting updates for everyone on how well it does or doesn't work.
If I wasn't confident in doing it I wouldn't be trying it :D
 

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Curious if you know the GPH or LPH flow volume of the TDI engine? This is a very crucial element in order to filter properly and have proper fuel volume.
Factory filter is synthetic media with organic.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Curious if you know the GPH or LPH flow volume of the TDI engine? This is a very crucial element in order to filter properly and have proper fuel volume.
Factory filter is synthetic media with organic.
Less than that of my Duramax with 700hp/ 1400 ft-lbs of torque running the same filter :grin2:
 

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Discussion Starter #18
That does not tell me much.

But anyway Duramax
Idle = .3 GPH
With ac on= .4 GPH
In gear= .6 GPH
Cruising @ 70 on flat ground= 3.5ish GPH
WOT= 18.XX GPH
Are those stock specs, or calculated using the approximated injection values for the torque?

If I have too i'll look it up, but if it's good enough for my fuel hungry dmax 8 cylinder i'm sure it will support my slightly modified 6 cylinder with less than half the displacement...
 

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I found them online (I mean there is an "ish" in there so they are probably not completely accurate but close enough) but really don't care about the durmax at all. I am wanting specific specs for the touareg. Just because the durmax has twice the displacement does not mean you should use the same filter. I guess I am a little more making sure things are correct for the specific vehicle not using a one size fits all approach. I'd like to have all the numbers in place to purchase the proper filter. Not to say yours won't work but I am just looking at this in a more accurate way.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I found them online (I mean there is an "ish" in there so they are probably not completely accurate but close enough) but really don't care about the durmax at all. I am wanting specific specs for the touareg. Just because the durmax has twice the displacement does not mean you should use the same filter. I guess I am a little more making sure things are correct for the specific vehicle not using a one size fits all approach. I'd like to have all the numbers in place to purchase the proper filter. Not to say yours won't work but I am just looking at this in a more accurate way.
What year duramax what that from? The HP/Tq vary greatly from 2001-2018

Now you don't care about the Duramax but you're the one that posted the specs :wink2:

Assuming worst case and that is from an LB7 rated at 235HP/ 500 Ft-Lbs of torque and considering our Touaregs have slightly more horsepower (higher RPM) and less torque I'd say that we should be pretty safe don't you considering the fuel filters ratings?

Up to 25 gpm (94.6 lpm) maximum flow
50 psi (3.4 bar) maximum working pressure

TE = 0.0226 x HP / fuel flow (GPH)
 
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