[Don W]

Ok-first off, I love this forum. It’s been fantastic in problem solving, but this is my first post/question.
Long story as short as I can make it- Got a low coolant notification. Could not spot anything in usual suspect areas and nothing on the ground so I topped it off. Got it again a couple of weeks later so I took a camera and took a better look. Lots of liquid around the oil cooler. I saw the posts here about coolant pooling in that area. I took it to the dealer (I have an unheated garage and January in Chicagoland…) who confirmed the oil cooler but insisted there was no coolant leak. I got the car back 4 weeks later with a new oil cooler and related parts. VW would not cover any under the warranty extension because the dealer would not say there was a coolant leak. Days after I got it back, coolant light. Argh.

So, the 1st Q I have is, if the egr cooler is leaking, will that all be going back into the recirculated exhaust or can some of it make it’s way down to the top of the V? It looks wet again, but it seems to be losing far more that what is pooling.
The second q I have is will the pressure test for the cooling system look fine even if the egr cooler is leaking? The answer I got from the dealer is that it passed the test so it’s not leaking (but it is…). They have had it for another week, did another pressure test and have not found a problem but they seem to be unwilling to consider the possibility that the egr system could be the source of the loss.

 

[Frank13]

For the 1st question. If the EGR is leaking internally pretty much all of it will get into the intake. There could be a leak from the EGR pipes but probably not enough to be noticeable. There's probably a leak somewhere else that they missed the last time around.
If you can try and take it to another dealer as you a right in that a pressure test is not 100% accurate when trying to find leaks. Particularly with cracks in metal components like EGR coolers, cylinder heads, and blocks, a cold engine can sometimes hold the pressure just fine but as soon as the metal starts expanding and opening up those cracks, you can start to lose quite a lot of coolant. The dealer and the techs working there definitely know this and are just screwing you out of your warranty. Take it to them and make them drive it for a few days so they can see the coolant level dropping.

 

[volkswagens-for-life]

Just stop doing any warranty maintenance yourself, let the dealer handle it all. That way they can track issues and fix them w/ less resistance.

 

[SaVAGeSoot]

What vehicle and engine are we diagnosing here?

 

[SaVAGeSoot]

I took it to the dealer (I have an unheated garage and January in Chicagoland…) who confirmed the oil cooler but insisted there was no coolant leak. I got the car back 4 weeks later with a new oil cooler and related parts. VW would not cover any under the warranty extension because the dealer would not say there was a coolant leak. Days after I got it back, coolant light. Argh.

So wait... you paid to have the oil cooler replaced at your cost even though the "mechanic" who said it was "the problem" also said there was no coolant leak? So what were both you and the dealer "addressing" by replacing a component what only has oil and coolant circulating through it? Were you also leaking oil?

 

[Don W]

What vehicle and engine are we diagnosing here?

Sorry for the delay and thanks for the response. It's a 2013 3.0 TDI Gen 2.1

 

[Don W]

So wait... you paid to have the oil cooler replaced at your cost even though the "mechanic" who said it was "the problem" also said there was no coolant leak? So what were both you and the dealer "addressing" by replacing a component what only has oil and coolant circulating through it? Were you also leaking oil?

There was also oil around the oil cooler. Before it was broken down, it was hard to see if there was coolant and/or oil, but it looked like there was oil in the mix and it turned out there was. I had them give me the old parts and the gaskets for the cooler are visibly shot. The tech said the oil cooler bolts were "loose" when he broke it down. Update is that the dealer took the car for another couple of weeks to try to find or replicate it losing coolant. I gave the tech permission to drive the car for a couple of days. I assume he did, but they still ended up getting back to me saying that it was not losing coolant and that the pressure was still holding. Sort of an undercurrent that I was imagining things. I got the car back (again) with nothing new "fixed" on it and sure enough, a week later and the light is on and the reservoir is well below minimum.

 

[Don W]

Just stop doing any warranty maintenance yourself, let the dealer handle it all. That way they can track issues and fix them w/ less resistance.

That's pretty much what I've done. Partly because I assumed they'd cover it, partly because this started in January and I live in Chicagoland with an unheated garage. In hindsight, I paid over 2300 to get about $650 in parts installed, so I'm having some regrets. My next steps include calling VW directly over this lingering coolant loss.

 

[volkswagens-for-life]

That's pretty much what I've done. Partly because I assumed they'd cover it, partly because this started in January and I live in Chicagoland with an unheated garage. In hindsight, I paid over 2300 to get about $650 in parts installed, so I'm having some regrets. My next steps include calling VW directly over this lingering coolant loss.

Believe me I feel your pain, I'm the same kind of guy... I was doing some of my own warranty repairs for a while too thinking it would be faster and less bullshit etc, but all that ended up happening was I wasted a ton of time and money and should have just let the dealership do it. Biggest reason is, often these emissions issues snowball so you fix one issue but then there are three other issues that break as a result of the first issue etc. And then you just end up chasing your tail

 

[SaVAGeSoot]

I got the car back (again) with nothing new "fixed" on it and sure enough, a week later and the light is on and the reservoir is well below minimum.

So does it throw any codes? Have you asked the dealer why your coolant is vanishing a week later if they've pressure tested the system and nothing is wrong? What exactly did they claim to have pressure tested?

 

[Don W]

So does it throw any codes? Have you asked the dealer why your coolant is vanishing a week later if they've pressure tested the system and nothing is wrong? What exactly did they claim to have pressure tested?

It does not throw any codes. About a year and half ago it was, and the EGR cooler was replaced under the extended diesel settlement warranty. Since then, no codes, but for months it's losing coolant. The dealer has no answers, and VW just tells me I need to go get a second dealer opinion (which would be at my own expense unless it's determined to be a warranty issue... but I've just been down that path at a cost of over $2K). The service manager told me they pressure tested it but was not able to give me specifics. I've been on them for months to look at the EGR also, but I keep getting pushback. The general answer I keep getting is that if the pressure holds, it's not possible for the EGR to have a coolant leak. I've sent posts and other info I've found on this forum but I don't have confidence that it was getting looked at.

He was the second service manager since January. He is now gone, and they are on their 3rd service manager since January. I'm thinking that that fact says a lot about what is going on there.

Maddening. Thing is, we really like the vehicle. I take care of it and generally it's held up great.

 

[volkswagens-for-life]

Wait for coolant to get low, return for low coolant service.

 

[Don W]

Wait for coolant to get low, return for low coolant service.

Thanks. I have done that. They have had possession of the car for roughly 6 weeks (not straight) out of the past 2 1/2 months. It’s now back at home while I contemplate trying a different dealership.

 

[volkswagens-for-life]

I would start calling dealerships and asking the service department if they have techs that went to the original Touareg classes

 

[SaVAGeSoot]

I'm not sure I follow. If you've visited multiple dealerships and even paid for diagnosis, you should be asking for refunds on those costs.... if your coolant is vanishing and the "experts" can't find the reason why, I'd be calling VWoA to let them know that their dealerships cannot even find the problem.... let alone address it.

 

[Don W]

I'm not sure I follow. If you've visited multiple dealerships and even paid for diagnosis, you should be asking for refunds on those costs.... if your coolant is vanishing and the "experts" can't find the reason why, I'd be calling VWoA to let them know that their dealerships cannot even find the problem.... let alone address it.

It's been to one dealer, multiple times. I did have a couple of calls with VWoA and yesterday I got a call back from the manager of the dealership. They are going to take the car back, give me a loaner and hopefully get it right this time? I'll add that the input I got from my thread and from others on the site was helpful in both being able to talk intelligently about the problem and in getting them to take yet another look at it, and to do so without another diagnostic charge. Fingers crossed...

 

[SaVAGeSoot]

Make sure that they check both your oil and your transmission fluid for contamination if they still can't find the leak, or if it still passes the pressure tests.

 

[SaVAGeSoot]

Don, when these guys "pressure test" the system, did they do it cold or hot?
I ask because our gen has an isolation valve that isolates the block coolant for quicker warmup, so if the coolant temp is below operating temp and that Coolant valve for cylinder head N489 isn't opened, they could potentially only be pressure testing 1/2 the system..... if the "leak" is in the portion which isn't being tested, it would explain why it passes the test but once you start operating it at normal temps, you start consuming\loosing coolant. I would also suggest you check the front of the motor to see if there's any evidence of the WP leaking.

 

[dtcohen18]

I have a 2015 TDI Exec with 89K miles and have a coolant leak somewhere I cannot detect. So taking into to dealership. I had a 2013 Touareg V6 that had same issue and it was water pump replacement. They covered it under the 100K warranty. As the issue of whether the WP is covered under extended warranty has come up on this forum It also should be covered under the extended TDI warranty. See here:

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10169142-0001.pdf