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I know the oil topic has been done to death, but I'm about to change the oil in my R5 for the first time since I've owned it. I've been doing some looking around as to what oil is available locally for me (blue mountains, Australia) and I noticed that supercheapauto has a Chief TDX oil in 5w 40 that meets the VW 505.01 standard.

Has anyone used this oil before and would recommend it?
 

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I know the oil topic has been done to death, but I'm about to change the oil in my R5 for the first time since I've owned it. I've been doing some looking around as to what oil is available locally for me (blue mountains, Australia) and I noticed that supercheapauto has a Chief TDX oil in 5w 40 that meets the VW 505.01 standard.

Has anyone used this oil before and would recommend it?
Try your supplier to contact Penrite they make a 0W30 enviro oil that is 506.01 and the right spec for the pumpe duse engines.
Is the TDX 505.01 mineral or synth but i think thts is just normal drain interval oil. Viscositiy seem higher thatn normal spec but in my opinion is better as i use 5w40 non 506.01 oil and samples have proven it to offer more protection.
But i have used the WRX chief oil (507.00) in VW transporters i have serviced and it seems OK.

regards
Drag
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for the info, I'll check up on that enviro oil. Chief was full synthetic.

My understanding was that 505.01 was for non long life servicing and 506.01 was for long life servicing. So just the period of time between oil changes can be longer with the 506.01. Although saying that, it must have better protection than the 505.01.
 

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505.01 is the one to go for at 10'000km.

It has the higher ZDDP additive for flat tappet shear forces that are huge on the cams due to their narrow design to make space for the pumpe duse injector cam.

506.01 is expensive and overkill and I wouldn't stretch the OCI on a pumpe duse engine anyway.

507.00 should be avoided at all costs in pre-DPF R5/V10 engines as the bearing require certain additives that are present in 505.01/506.01 but not in 507.00.
 

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505.01 is the one to go for at 10'000km.

It has the higher ZDDP additive for flat tappet shear forces that are huge on the cams due to their narrow design to make space for the pumpe duse injector cam.

506.01 is expensive and overkill and I wouldn't stretch the OCI on a pumpe duse engine anyway.

507.00 should be avoided at all costs in pre-DPF R5/V10 engines as the bearing require certain additives that are present in 505.01/506.01 but not in 507.00.
Hey 4ePikanini

We go thru this all the time, were is it documented that the bearings are of a different composition in the DPF engine to the non DPF engine.
Glyco only make 1 bearing for both DPF and Non DPF engines and by the way for the V10 VW list undersizes on the crankshaft for grinding but no O/S bearings are available.

But I love a good agree to disagree situation.

Good on you 4ePikanini all ways worth while

regards
Drag
 

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Hey 4ePikanini

We go thru this all the time, were is it documented that the bearings are of a different composition in the DPF engine to the non DPF engine.
Glyco only make 1 bearing for both DPF and Non DPF engines and by the way for the V10 VW list undersizes on the crankshaft for grinding but no O/S bearings are available.

But I love a good agree to disagree situation.

Good on you 4ePikanini all ways worth while

regards
Drag
AFAIK, it's the wear on the PD cam lobes that wear if the incorrect oil is used, not any bearings.

The PD injectors exert very high pressures on the cam.
 

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Here you go.

Ever wondered why you see the notice on 507.00 oil bottles that state "Not to be used in R5/V10 engines"?

Example :

Mobil 1 507.00 approved discourages R5/V10 use





Combination of manuals and forums really, but one German forum summed it up nicely (previously posted on your build thread):

Kapitaler Motorschaden bei 77t km [Archiv] - Touareg-Freunde

Here is a little explanation in German:

Das ist eigentlich ganz simpel, der R5 ohne DPF hat Kurbelwellenlager verbaut, welche die Bleiadditive des Longlife2 als Schmierung nutzen. Die Kennzeichnung des Motors ist dann BAC & Kurbelwellenlager Index B. Wenn nun das Longlife3 verfüllt wird, wo diese Bleiadditive fehlen, entzieht man den Kurbelwellenlagern die Schmierung. Als Resultat laufen die irgendwann heiß und schlagen irgendwann aus. Dieser erhöhte Spielraum führt dazu, daß die Kolben im Hubraum an der Plasmabeschichtung kratzen. Sobald diese Beschichtung fehlt, gibt das Material nach und Du kannst nen Blumentopf in den Motorraum stecken.

Das ist leider ein ganz großes Problem mit dem R5 Motörchen ohne Werks-DPF, es ist ein dreckiges Ding. Alle Nachrüstlösungen sind somit mit äußerster Vorsicht zu genießen!!!!

Welches Öl Du nun einfüllen mußt ist im Grunde simpel, Longlife2 um den Motor zu retten und Longlife3 um die Filter zu schonen.


R5 ohne DPF: Motorkennzeichen BAC Kurbelwellenlager Index B
R5 mit DPF: Motorkennzeichen BPD & BPE Kurbelwellenlager Index C

Basically translated:

=========

The R5 without DPF has crankshaft bearings which rely on lead additives present in the Longlife 2 oil (506.01). This is for BAC engines. If other oils are used, the bearings are not lubricated sufficiently, which leads to overheating and eventual failure. This results in the piston running uneven, which destroys the plasma coating on the cylinder wall with the consequence that the cylinder block becomes useful as a flowerpot only.

R5 without DPF = Engines labeled BAC, have crank shaft bearings 'Index B'
R5 with DPF: Engines labeled BPD & BPE, have crank shaft bearings 'Index C'

=========

In conclusion, there is an issue with the bearings and oils other than 506.01 on the BAC engines. When DPF's became essential, VW changed the bearings to tolerate 507 oil, otherwise fitting DPF's would be impossible due to the ash 'content' of the 506.01.

Everyone with an R5 without DPF in South Africa (which should be every R5), use ONLY 506.01 oil, nothing else.


AFAIK, it's the wear on the PD cam lobes that wear if the incorrect oil is used, not any bearings.

The PD injectors exert very high pressures on the cam.

No, 507.00 is in that respect a much better oil. You can use 507.00 in 1.9 tdi PD, 2.0 TDi PD and all other VW/Audi diesels.

The bearings on the pre-DPF R5/V10 are of a different alloy/coating and requires a certain additive (I think it's lead) that is present in 505.01/506.01 but not in 507.00.
 

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Here you go.

Ever wondered why you see the notice on 507.00 oil bottles that state "Not to be used in R5/V10 engines"?

Example :

Mobil 1 507.00 approved discourages R5/V10 use

But VW spec for the V10 with DPF & R5 with DPF is 507.00 both are unit injector (Pumpe Duse) engines exactly like the pre DPF models.
Clear difference in the 506.01 to 507.00 oils is the soot content so not to clog the DPF.

Originally Posted by Kortgat
Combination of manuals and forums really, but one German forum summed it up nicely (previously posted on your build thread):

Kapitaler Motorschaden bei 77t km [Archiv] - Touareg-Freunde

Here is a little explanation in German:

Das ist eigentlich ganz simpel, der R5 ohne DPF hat Kurbelwellenlager verbaut, welche die Bleiadditive des Longlife2 als Schmierung nutzen. Die Kennzeichnung des Motors ist dann BAC & Kurbelwellenlager Index B. Wenn nun das Longlife3 verfüllt wird, wo diese Bleiadditive fehlen, entzieht man den Kurbelwellenlagern die Schmierung. Als Resultat laufen die irgendwann heiß und schlagen irgendwann aus. Dieser erhöhte Spielraum führt dazu, daß die Kolben im Hubraum an der Plasmabeschichtung kratzen. Sobald diese Beschichtung fehlt, gibt das Material nach und Du kannst nen Blumentopf in den Motorraum stecken.

Das ist leider ein ganz großes Problem mit dem R5 Motörchen ohne Werks-DPF, es ist ein dreckiges Ding. Alle Nachrüstlösungen sind somit mit äußerster Vorsicht zu genießen!!!!

Welches Öl Du nun einfüllen mußt ist im Grunde simpel, Longlife2 um den Motor zu retten und Longlife3 um die Filter zu schonen.


R5 ohne DPF: Motorkennzeichen BAC Kurbelwellenlager Index B
R5 mit DPF: Motorkennzeichen BPD & BPE Kurbelwellenlager Index C

Basically translated:

=========

The R5 without DPF has crankshaft bearings which rely on lead additives present in the Longlife 2 oil (506.01). This is for BAC engines. If other oils are used, the bearings are not lubricated sufficiently, which leads to overheating and eventual failure. This results in the piston running uneven, which destroys the plasma coating on the cylinder wall with the consequence that the cylinder block becomes useful as a flowerpot only.

R5 without DPF = Engines labeled BAC, have crank shaft bearings 'Index B'
R5 with DPF: Engines labeled BPD & BPE, have crank shaft bearings 'Index C'

=========

In conclusion, there is an issue with the bearings and oils other than 506.01 on the BAC engines. When DPF's became essential, VW changed the bearings to tolerate 507 oil, otherwise fitting DPF's would be impossible due to the ash 'content' of the 506.01.

Everyone with an R5 without DPF in South Africa (which should be every R5), use ONLY 506.01 oil, nothing else.

Above is just a post from forum it is just the same as we are discussing here and no evidence??

No, 507.00 is in that respect a much better oil. You can use 507.00 in 1.9 tdi PD, 2.0 TDi PD and all other VW/Audi diesels.

How is it better by having lower soot levels ?

Originally Posted by 4eTouareg
AFAIK, it's the wear on the PD cam lobes that wear if the incorrect oil is used, not any bearings.

The PD injectors exert very high pressures on the cam.


Could not agree more the narrow inlet & exhaust lobes are the Achilles heel of the Pumpe Duse engine

The bearings on the pre-DPF R5/V10 are of a different alloy/coating and requires a certain additive (I think it's lead) that is present in 505.01/506.01 but not in 507.00.

Check VW part numbers for pre DPF and DPF models.
Also cut and pastes directly from the OEM bearing supplier (Glyco) catalogue regarding all 5 cylinder engine codes.

Mains - lead free steel back aluminum Bi / tri metal

B/E - Steel back sputter bearing Trimetallic

Most if not all of modern diesels now have sputtered bigend bearings for the load carrying capacity required in the modern common rail engines.





regards
drag
 

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I believe the old bearings have been superseded by the new design (DPF bearings)

why does the oil companies state on their bottle not to use the 507.00 in pre-dpf R5/v10?

I will try and see if I can get historical part numbers.
 

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Amongst the quotes above one says "Everyone with an R5 without DPF ... use ONLY 506.01 oil, nothing else".

That is what I've always thought, but I trust Marius and hadn't heard before about 505.01 being acceptable.

I change the oil at least every 10K (usually sooner) and have always used 506.01. Should I be using 505.01?
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Amongst the quotes above one says "Everyone with an R5 without DPF ... use ONLY 506.01 oil, nothing else".

That is what I've always thought, but I trust Marius and hadn't heard before about 505.01 being acceptable.

I change the oil at least every 10K (usually sooner) and have always used 506.01. Should I be using 505.01?
Out of interest, what 506.01 have you been using?
 

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My dad with his v10 as well as myself with my r5 use 505.01.

My dad's v10 is now on 300'000km and when i check his injector deviances on VCDS they are all between 0.2 and -0.2. That indicates that the injectors, cams, and compression are all still good.

We do 10'000km oil changes.

Its too early to tell on mine as i replaced the engine not too long ago due to a broken ring.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I was under the impression that the V10 and the 2.5 were basically the same. One obviously double the size of the other.

In my manual it says the V10 can use both 505.01 and 506.01 depending on the service schedule but the R5 can only use 506.01.
 

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I was under the impression that the V10 and the 2.5 were basically the same. One obviously double the size of the other. In my manual it says the V10 can use both 505.01 and 506.01 depending on the service schedule but the R5 can only use 506.01.

That was true until 2006 in many markets, when VW needed to install DPF to comply with emissions. After then, those with DPF need 507.00
 

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i read thousands of thread discuss about oil for R5 that which correct oil to fill in my engine. My T2 R5 2.5TDi 2008 and i still wonder my car has DPF or not, i look over the trunk, fuel cover but there are no sign of AdBlue refill hole. Since i bought my second hand R5, the dealer still fill Castrol Edge 507 for my engine so i really confuse is there any other way to make sure my R5 haven't got DPF? If it is, i will switch to use 505 right away.
p.s: My T2 imported from Germany but my country is developing country -Vietnam (ussually VW will not put DPF on R5 for some country using low quality oil like mine or South Africa).
- I also lost my hand book so i cant decode any options on my car.
 

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the non-dpf versions has no sensors on the exhaust.
 

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If there are any sensors it would be between the turbo and the Catalytic converter you can see just left of your transmission oil pan.
 

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i read thousands of thread discuss about oil for R5 that which correct oil to fill in my engine. My T2 R5 2.5TDi 2008 and i still wonder my car has DPF or not, i look over the trunk, fuel cover but there are no sign of AdBlue refill hole. Since i bought my second hand R5, the dealer still fill Castrol Edge 507 for my engine so i really confuse is there any other way to make sure my R5 haven't got DPF? If it is, i will switch to use 505 right away.
p.s: My T2 imported from Germany but my country is developing country -Vietnam (ussually VW will not put DPF on R5 for some country using low quality oil like mine or South Africa).
- I also lost my hand book so i cant decode any options on my car.
If there are any sensors it would be between the turbo and the Catalytic converter you can see just left of your transmission oil pan.
@Zidzep,
less complicated way to check:
http://www.clubtouareg.com/forums/f93/anyone-seen-a-2004-r5-with-a-dpf-fitted-160833.html (post#3)

P.S. I use 507.00 VW OEM or Castrol Edge oils safely too. Mine will hit 150,000 km jubilee soon.
 
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