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Discussion Starter #1
Hello

Has anyone upgraded brake system from 4 pistons to 6 pistons with bigger rotors? I am thinking about the change, but things are not easy and may take long time to complete. The main problem is the arms for 4 pistons are different from ones for 6 pistons. I can make brackets for the change, but I don't have technical data..I need help. Has anyone tried the change?

The following picture is 4 piston calipers.
ea1baf8f6f009f1ab7386cb04291b297.jpg

This is for 6 piston ones.
f0ec6e2620de92df4143960c11617e57.jpg
 

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The 6 Piston and Calliper you are showing is from the R50 and is the most expensive solution. You can alternatively use a Brembo 18Z with 350 mm rotors or a Brembo 17Z with stock 330 mm rotors.

I have done this upgrade and the detail are in the below link......

http://www.clubtouareg.com/forums/f44/why-would-you-upgrade-the-brakes-on-a-my09-v6-tdi-203562.html

The 350 mm option has also been done ........

http://www.clubtouareg.com/forums/f64/v6-big-brake-upgrade-58893.html

One simple question, did you actually search before posting...could have saved you a heap of time...

Stuart....
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thank you very much for your comment!

I know that 18z brembo is for touareg 2002~2010. But my concern is mine is 2015 touareg. Does the 18z brembo fit my brake system? If not, the 18z brembo seems to need much more alternation. Thank you!
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Another advantage of the 6 piston of the picture is the rotor size is 360mm and 36T. 350mm rotors are only 32T. The thickness of the rotors is as important as the diameter as far as I know, so I chose the 6 piston calipers as a candidate.
 

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Bonsu, First off. I am not an expert or a mechanic. I am a new 2014 TDI R-line owner and new to the forum. I more than welcome any corrections and feedback from other members actual personal experiences with this mod.

That said:

From the research I have done and feedback from a few members yes the 18Z 350mm are a direct bolt on. I am very interested in doing the same update and have been researching it for weeks.

The wrenching is not going to be an issue for me and not likely for you or anyone who has a post 2011 and wants 18Z's. The main concern I am running into is the ABS coding necessary from going from a 17Z 4 pot to an 18Z 6 pot 350mm. I spoke with a nice lady at Ross-Tech today and she explained in great (very technical) detail the complications of unlocking the necessary encrypted VAG codes to ensure that the ABS works. She also explained that until VW hands out the coding for each of the vehicles year the likelihood of it coming available is slim. Why? The OEM 4 pot calipers are more than capable so why bother? So few people want to mod their Treg beyond wheels that the demand is just not there.

(Ross-tech said the code upgrade requests for the Treg are updated tow packages)

Is updated coding necessary to ensure that the integrity of the ABS remains intact after a BBK? I have no idea. As for me as much as I want to install a BBK on my Treg to personalize / performance / look and feel I am not willing to risk my brakes not working during a situation of consequence.

I would appreciate if you or anyone would keep me in the loop on any research that you come across concerning coding (and its necessity).

And again, I am not an expert or a mechanic and have not attempted or completed this mod.

Regards,

Goa
 

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Very sensible and well reasoned post.
 

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Any updates on this? Looking to upgrade my 2013 V6TDI to either 17z or 18z. Wondering if either bolt up directly, or if the steering knuckle is different. Also wondering if anyone has resolved the coding isssue.
 

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Any updates on this? Looking to upgrade my 2013 V6TDI to either 17z or 18z. Wondering if either bolt up directly, or if the steering knuckle is different. Also wondering if anyone has resolved the coding isssue.
18Z will fit straight on. No other mods needed. Direct fit.
 

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Do you happen to have a part number for those rotors? Any places I've called don't know how to look it up without part numbers, or vehicles that they're originally fitted to. Thanks again. :)
 

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18Z are the OEM brakes on my 2014 Q7 TDI, use it as a base vehicle.. I go with Zimmerman rotors and OEM/Pagid pads from FCPEuro.
 

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There is one more thing.......piston area. "VW switched the Touareg to in 2007 (they were called "1LE" at the time). They look identical and same rotor size. If correct, then something to be aware of is that these calipers have 4x 46mm pistons- which gives a massive piston area. 9% more than 17Z (of which the area is already quite large) and 20% more than 18Z.
1LE 2x46mm pistons - 3324 mm^2
18Z 30/34/38mm - 2749 mm^2
17Z 34/36/38mm - 3060 mm^2
In theory if everything else is equal 1LE will have ~20% increased pressure than 18Z. Saying all that, I think the new Brembo 1LE caliper looks sexy, smoth and having no external cross-pipe is a big bonus and improvement over the old 17Z and 18 Z .
Larger piston area on 1LE will give you greater clamping force, but at expense of extra pedal travel and luxury style braking feel(soccer mom pedal :))
 

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1LE's are not superior to 18Z, they are just the cheaper successor for 17Z.. according to your math there the 17Z's are better than the 18Z's.. VW switched from 17Z to 1LE for the T3's which weighed less and had less power, so could get away with cheaper brakes with less pistons.. the 18Z has bigger rotors, more pistons.

An extra piston on each side of the caliper is going to result in more even pressure than the combined size of all pistons, you have to realize the backing of the pads is a solid chunk of steel, a bigger piston wont let it apply more pressure to the rotors more than more pistons spread out more evenly.. IMO in order of performance, 1LE (330mm) -> 17Z (330mm) -> 18Z (350mm)

lets look at just the costs of the left caliper, that pretty clearly shows order of performance.. better calipers dont get cheaper.
1LE - $430: Front Brake Caliper - left
17Z - $455: Front Brake caliper - left
18Z - $488: Front Brake Caliper - Black - Left

So from T2 to T3 some Beancounter saved $120 per vehicle on brakes, after a couple hundred thousand vehicles he just paid for his boss's bonus.. just because its newer dont mean its an upgrade.
 

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1LE's are not superior to 18Z, they are just the cheaper successor for 17Z.. according to your math there the 17Z's are better than the 18Z's.. VW switched from 17Z to 1LE for the T3's which weighed less and had less power, so could get away with cheaper brakes with less pistons.. the 18Z has bigger rotors, more pistons.

An extra piston on each side of the caliper is going to result in more even pressure than the combined size of all pistons, you have to realize the backing of the pads is a solid chunk of steel, a bigger piston wont let it apply more pressure to the rotors more than more pistons spread out more evenly.. IMO in order of performance, 1LE (330mm) -> 17Z (330mm) -> 18Z (350mm)

lets look at just the costs of the left caliper, that pretty clearly shows order of performance.. better calipers dont get cheaper.
1LE - $430: Front Brake Caliper - left
17Z - $455: Front Brake caliper - left
18Z - $488: Front Brake Caliper - Black - Left

So from T2 to T3 some Beancounter saved $120 per vehicle on brakes, after a couple hundred thousand vehicles he just paid for his boss's bonus.. just because its newer dont mean its an upgrade.
I am not saying that it is superior. It is a great system Brembo BM5 that is doing it is job just not that good compared to 17Z and 18Z. My math is correct no doubt about it. The problem is that piston area is important but not essential. Rotor size, pads size, number of pistons. 1LE is not competitor to 17Z and 18Z and can not be compared directly. It is juts a newer improved Brembo product, but it does not make it superior to 17Z and 18Z.
 

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Two more questions! Do you buy the bolt kit for the Q7 or V10, or do you buy the stock bolt kit from the vehicle originally? I assume the kit from the 18z vehicles. Also, do you buy pad wear sensors from the stock vehicle, or from another vehicle? I'm putting them on a 2013 Touareg.
 

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do you buy pad wear sensors from the stock vehicle, or from another vehicle? I'm putting them on a 2013 Touareg.
You can use the original wear sensors of the four pot calipers, however the six pot caliper use a dual wear sensor set up. One for the inner pad and the another one for the outer pad.
If you decide to use the latter, you can find it as a Touareg V10 part.
I hope it helps.

Gabriel
 

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Thanks everyone in here for the help! All of the parts are on order, and should be here soon. Do I need to recode the ABS module with VCDS?/ Any directions for doing that?
Thanks!!
 
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