[Built4Sin]

Governments shouldn't manage anything business wise! I'll agree with that; but they can invest / back emerging technology.

Electric cars are not new. However the storage capacity that they have and are gaining is. So the question is should something like that be subsidized? I say yes, because historically we all benefit from it.

Now as you've previously said Solyndra failed, but that had to more to do with outside factors like China flooding the market and falling silicone prices. So did they fail because the tech was bogus? Not by a long-shot.

Technology is always risky, but hey look at me chatting with you on my cellphone from the beaches of Florida!

 

[BeemerMikeTX]

Electric cars are not new. However the storage capacity that they have and are gaining is. So the question is should something like that be subsidized? I say yes, because historically we all benefit from it.

Then invest in/subsidize the R&D to develop battery storage capacity that may not be funded otherwise by private industry, and not in subsidizing a product that may or may not be using it.

Technology is always risky, but hey look at me chatting with you on my cellphone from the beaches of Florida!

And the role of the federal government in developing that cell phone was what exactly?

 

[m-fine]

Electric cars are not new. However the storage capacity that they have and are gaining is. So the question is should something like that be subsidized? I say yes, because historically we all benefit from it.

Lithium ion battery tech was developed four decades ago and they have been commercially available for more than 25 years. The "gains" in storage capacity for electric cars can pretty much be summarized by "find more room to put more batteries." Not exactly a world changing technological leap.

The gains in capacity per volume came from battery advancement research at MIT, UT, Japan and elsewhere that had no connection to the electric car industry.

If you think that is something that should be subsidized or that we all are benefiting from, I need to STRONGLY disagree.

 

[Built4Sin]

This thread apparently isn't reality based.

Beamermike therefore is right, nothing that has been partially, marginally, or completely bankrolled by the US government has been of technological use.

 

[BeemerMikeTX]

This thread apparently isn't reality based. Beamermike therefore is right, nothing that has been partially, marginally, or completely bankrolled by the US government has been of technological use.

Not what I said.

And it's "Beemer", not "Beamer".

 

[yuyueyuyue]

Just a reminder, it's not just a car with a big pack of batteries.

Tesla is not about being an EV. It's the software.

Capable of Finding parking spot in a parking lot and park on its own. I know i3 does this, but that's only in well organized Germany.

Drop you off at LAX and then meet you at JFK. Also charge itself at Supercharge stations along the way.

Nightly OS updates for new features for free. You wake up in the morning and suddenly your car can do self driving or can do 0-60 0.2 seconds faster...

 

[BeemerMikeTX]

So what part of the Tesla justifies a federal taxpayer subsidy to buyers?

 

[m-fine]

Drop you off at LAX and then meet you at JFK. Also charge itself at Supercharge stations along the way.

LOL, uh NO! Set down the Kool Aid and come back to reality for a bit.

 

[Jimbuffalo]

so, what's the fix on an eGolf? software? controller board?

 

[Oregon TDI]

so, what's the fix on an eGolf? software? controller board?

Initial reports suggested a software update would fix it.

 

[yuyueyuyue]

So what part of the Tesla justifies a federal taxpayer subsidy to buyers?

Was comparing Tesla to other EVs. Did I say anything about tax?

LOL, uh NO! Set down the Kool Aid and come back to reality for a bit.

Of course it won't go faster than a plane, but it will get there.

Google Tesla Summon, and check back in 3 years.

 

[182RG]

So what part of the Tesla justifies a federal taxpayer subsidy to buyers?

The same part that Ford, GM, Fiat/Chrysler, Boeing, Intel, Nike, Alcoa, and Shell apparently use as well.

The 8 Biggest Corporate Welfare Recipients in America

Whether the buyer gets it or the Corporation gets it is irrelevant.

Tell you what, how about we take the BS Libertarian political aspect out of this thread, and focus on the topic?

 

[BeemerMikeTX]

Tell you what, how about we take the BS Libertarian political aspect out of this thread, and focus on the topic?

Because folks are talking about how great e-cars are, but customers don't seem to want to really buy them unless taxpayers help them pay for it. :-k

 

[Oregon TDI]

Believing that Tesla wouldn't sell any cars without tax credits is just one of many flavors of KoolAid to choose from. ;-)

 

[BeemerMikeTX]

Believing that Tesla wouldn't sell any cars without tax credits is just one of many flavors of KoolAid to choose from. ;-)

Then why do we have subsidies for e-cars?

 

[Oregon TDI]

Then why do we have subsidies for e-cars?

Honestly I don't think you're open to any point of view except the one you've formed. Or if you prefer, I've selected a different flavor of KoolAid. Don't take it personally!

 

[Fourdiesel]

Then why do we have subsidies for e-cars?

Because, just like anything else, the Gov'mt - believing it alone has all the correct solutions - is anxious to create/support a monopoly by backing a particular product or technology in this way. They have found that by creating a kickback people really believe they are getting a deal and doing a 'good thing' for a cause at the same time.
None of the government's claims about correct solutions are true but no skeptics will be listened to.

 

[Oregon TDI]

Because, just like anything else, the Gov'mt - believing it alone has all the correct solutions - is anxious to create/support a monopoly by backing a particular product or technology in this way. They have found that by creating a kickback people really believe they are getting a deal and doing a 'good thing' for a cause at the same time. None of the government's claims about correct solutions are true but no skeptics will be listened to.

What monopoly?

 

[Jimbuffalo]

https://www.teslamotors.com/support/incentives

Widespread tax incentivism with respect to the Tesla doesn't seem to be all that widespread to me, but playing the tax game is a reality these days. Any chance I can to pay less in taxes is a good thing. For example, one reason I trade in vehicles is to reduce the price at which the tax is calculated.

I get the big picture, and reformation of the tax code is most definitely needed and long over due. But in the meantime one would be foolish to not scratch back pennies after all the dollars you're forced to contribute have been spent, wasted, forgotten.

As in the following excerpt, all those tax dollars going to Tesla is about what this country spends on cigars and cigarettes each year. Same tune, different decade.

http://www.explore.rice.edu/explore/Kennedy_Address.asp

I think we're ten years out and I'm still not convinced...but it's a comin' lads, it's a comin'.

 

[BeemerMikeTX]

Honestly I don't think you're open to any point of view except the one you've formed. Or if you prefer, I've selected a different flavor of KoolAid. Don't take it personally!

Oh, I'm open. Please tell me why we're giving subsidies to people to buy an e-car?

When my brother bought his Ford C-Max last year, he bought the rechargeable version because of the subsidy. Without the subsidy he would have bought the regular hybrid.