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Discussion Starter #21
I don't understand what you are trying to prove.
Judging by your "answer", you don't understand the question either: "Who is running 87 octane in their Treg?"
Not that complicated really.
 

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You're right.... let me answer that one.

NO ONE who has options and who also likes their engine (or who likes to have a properly running\performing one).
 

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You're right.... let me answer that one.

NO ONE who has options and who also likes their engine (or who likes to have a properly running\performing one).
Avatar checks out.

I've been running 87 in my '11 since 54K miles and I am fairly certain the original owner did as well. At 200K now, and have had NO engine problems. I guess I have nothing to compare it to since this is the only Treg I've ever driven. Seems like guys in here love to flex anytime someone asks this question.
 

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Avatar checks out.

I've been running 87 in my '11 since 54K miles and I am fairly certain the original owner did as well. At 200K now, and have had NO engine problems. I guess I have nothing to compare it to since this is the only Treg I've ever driven. Seems like guys in here love to flex anytime someone asks this question.
I guess manufacturer's minimum octane requirements are FAKE, just like Global Warming.,,,,,,, excuse me while I go flex :grin2:
 

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As long as the electronic anti knock system is working, the engine should be ok. There is a possibility of damage if the anti knock system dies. If this is an acceptable risk or not is something that each driver has to decide.

You will lose power. 0 to 60 times will be slower. Some people don't notice or if they do, they don't care about that. MPG goes down a small amount.

The real killer for me was the fact that the loss of power meant the vehicle started downshifting on hills where it normally pulled them in high gear. That was aggravating enough for me that when I added the fact I was losing MPG also, that I gave up and went back with the 93 ethanol.

Mellow drivers living in a flat area probably would notice nothing different.

tldr: It's your car and you can do what you want. All I can do is tell you how it worked out for me.
 

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I have been running 87 octane in my 2014 V6 3.6 engine for the past two years and have not noticed any performance or decrease in mileage. Cost difference is substantial, Chicago is pretty flat, and the Touareg is not a sports car so I’m happy to go this way. I do look for TopTier fuel, mostly buying from Costco. I know VW owners can get very excited about doing this but there was an interesting article in one of the car mags recently that also found that most naturally aspirated engines did just fine without using the recommended premium.
 

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I live at 8500', have a VCDS and regularly drive between 6,000' and 10,000'. Will be happy to run some VCDS logging if you let me know what needs to be logged.
 

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If you think it's knock you're hearing, check your timing logs to see if there's pull happening. Also, make sure you run the correct copper plugs with the correct heat range. Once you start running crappy fuel, leaning out or fouling plugs due to whatever, you need to freshen up the plugs and start experimenting with the gap and heat range... Don't run platinum plugs as they are for lazy People who want to not look at them for 60k+.... Not for those who want a properly performing engine.

Have you considered running seafoam though it? Carbon buildup will cause hot spots and sometimes induce problems like you're describing, etc.
I will doing some extensive logging this summer. I have replaced the valve cover gasket and have found a noticeable amount of carbon buildup but didn't have the tools to the do a proper cleaning. I will try the cleaning later. I replaced the valve cover because of an oil leak. I have replaced the plugs with the correct ngk ones, not the platinum version. I checked the gap and it's less than 1mm so within spec. I still have the old coils I bought it with. I plan to replace them with some beru ones if replacing the variable intake shift rod bushings does not cure the knock/noise/rolling marbles.
 

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Log your cam position, knock sensor voltage and timing pull (VAGcom).
Not sure how VVT works on the V8 (I am used to 22 degrees intake cam at 4200 rpm).
What do you mean by "if the timing check procedure is still not accurate according to the internet."?
I will do the logging soon.
I have seen mixed opinions about the accuracy and condition of the timing check tests. When and how to log and how to interpret and what measure blocks are really relevant. I don't have the links right now but will put them if I get m hands on them.

And here is why I'm also suspecting the knock sensors:

https://wellsve.com/sft503/counterp_v4_i4_2000.pdf
 

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Discussion Starter #31
Just filled up again with 87, full tank this time for proper mileage documentation (and see how board computer display compares to to actual mileage on 87).
Will log timing pull periodically (the timing pull (ecu reduces timing advance) is what people notice as 'less power'; the engine tunes itself to lower octane gas).
 

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^^Try driving up some steep hills if you want to notice the loss. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #33
^^Try driving up some steep hills if you want to notice the loss. ;)
I can 'see' the loss (in my log), when requesting (with your right foot) high power output.
I see if I can write a logging template for our better (a lot more data points and parameters to log) loggers. Could then even do a side by side comparo for 0-60, or in gear acceleration to quantify the loss.
Would also be the basis (if I decided to go with 93 ONLY) to retune for the high octane fuel, i.e. INCREASE the timing advance a bit until the ECU start to pull timing again; typical gains (commercial example, not sure if they tune specifically for 93 octane):

Upgrade
Difference
Power hp 310 hp
322 hp
12 hp (+4%)
Torque / traction 410 Nm
432 Nm
22 Nm (+5%)
 

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Discussion Starter #34
Would also be the basis (if I decided to go with 93 ONLY) to retune for the high octane fuel, i.e. INCREASE the timing advance a bit until the ECU start to pull timing again
Have also tuned with up to 6 "degree" timing pull on pump gas ON PURPOSE, so that the 'hidden' potential can be tapped into by filling up with higher octane gas. i should still have a side by side comparison of such a case somewhere. Obviously not something for the 'casual' user.
 

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Have also tuned with up to 6 "degree" timing pull on pump gas ON PURPOSE, so that the 'hidden' potential can be tapped into by filling up with higher octane gas. i should still have a side by side comparison of such a case somewhere. Obviously not something for the 'casual' user.
Is VAG-Com used to adjust the timing? Just got mine this weekend and still exploring.
 

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Discussion Starter #36
Is VAG-Com used to adjust the timing? Just got mine this weekend and still exploring.
No. Only for 'softcoding' and basic logging.
For changing engine tunes, you need dedicated tuning software (tunerpro for example). And a lot of knowledge. Best left to someone who knows what he is doing.
Hint: the operator manual that Bosch wrote for the OEMs (Audi, VW, etc) for the Me7 is 1800 pages long.

For the Audi/VW Bosch ECU, a good site where tuners hang out is Nefmoto.
 
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