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Discussion Starter #1
First post here, owner of a 2002 Jetta TDI 5 speed that I've been working on myself for a while, I'm happy with where's it at currently and a few days purchased a 2006 3.2L V6 gas Touareg to add to the collection. Here's all the important stuff:


  • Test drove the truck about a week ago, it had been sitting for 6 months or so as it was being sold by someone for a relative (red flag no1?) the test drive was fine, I didn't hear any timing rattling. The car had some CELs for misfires (I brought my vag cable) seller said the old battery went bad/dead and it had all kinds of dash lights on, he replaced the battery. I cleared the CELs before test driving and they didn't come back and there were no engine troubles/noises etc.
  • Purchased the Treg two days ago, when I first picked it up from the parking lot it was dropped off at it had a rough start and idle for about 30 seconds and then it cleared up. Drove it around on this 1/4 tank of 6 month old fuel I guess with no issues after that. Car started, drove, shifted just fine.
  • I had it at home today and was doing some more inspecting under the hood. I cleaned up the PCV valve and where it connects into the intake as it had some oil residue - bad PCV?
  • I was checking the codes again and it had some more misfire codes, I shut the car off to read the airbag code (as instructed by vagcom) and upon restarting the vehicle it wanted to stall out and was bucking around 500 RPMs. It then started to read codes p0016 plus all of the misfire codes. I'm now not able to start the car without a bit of extended cranking and gas pedal.
At this point, thinking it could be bad fuel and now bad fuel filters due to contamination? I've also read that a bad PCV can cause bucking and similar issues. I've put a can of sea foam in the tank with no change.

Thinking either limp to the gas station to top the tank off with fresh fuel, or fill up a bunch of jerry cans to dilute whatever is in there, maybe replace fuel filters, also inspect and clean the cam sensors in case that's the issue?

Any help, ideas, brainstorming would be much appreciated.
 

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A new PCV is cheap enough and easy to fit but do buy VW and not aftermarket as they seem to fail quickly.

Fresh fuel and then take the car for a hard 50 mile thrash using Tiptronic to hold the revs for an Italian tune up.

Then see what the issues are.
 

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Sort of sounds like coil pack issues too. If the fuel doesn't clear it up, check the coil packs.
 

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Sort of sounds like coil pack issues too. If the fuel doesn't clear it up, check the coil packs.
My bet is camshaft position sensors. Not certain if poor timing can cause a sensor error but pretty certain camshaft position errors will lead to misfire codes. I would replace both sensors on back of the block topside. Held on by one bolt and easy to replace. Have to pretty much lay on top of engine intake. A little mirror will help you see the sensor and bolt I would unscrew pull then undo plug. On the install connect plug then sensor.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Tank is almost topped off with fresh 91 octane, still about a quarter tank of junk in there. Spark plugs are entirely black, and the air filter is pretty rough so I'm going to replace those and keep topping off the tank while pulling/cleaning the sensors and going from there. Looking at some replacement sensors now but I'd like to get the plugs and filter and gas sorted first to see if it clears up. Seems like it ran a bit better I tried to keep it around 1500 RPMs for 10 minutes or so but it still won't idle on its own without bucking.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Well I finally got the PCV off, silly me basically broke the thing thinking it was suctioned in by the nipple - just had to pop the tabs in... I'll be getting a new one anyways.

Inspected the coils, the furthest cylinder's coil was basically fused to the spark plug tube, the upper section of the coil broke off leaving the metal tube lodged in there. I figured this was a good time to remove the intake manifold and valve cover to 1. get the coil fully out and 2. inspect the valve train, take a peak around. Took about 6 hours! Fun times working behind that engine... That bracket back there is a racket.

I got the coil pack out, but there is some weird creamy looking oil/sludge all over the timing area and I saw it in the PCV tube, it's also all in the valve cover where the PCV tube enters. Any idea on that? Reading that it's likely condensation, the treg hasn't been driven much for months and it's pretty cold here, the PCV may also not have been operating properly.

Going to be giving it hard runs and changing the oil at a higher frequency if/when I get this thing running again.

I imagine there will also not be a better time to change the cams sensors than this, I can get to them pretty easily - they also look pretty cruddy as I have the valve cover off and can see the magnets.

So I'm thinking... PCV valve, coils, plugs, air filter, I broke some vacuum hose that has a hard section going into a rubber section, to the left of the engine - I'll have to look that up or see if I can rig it together.'

Throw two cam sensors at it, because they seem to go bad and there's never going to be a better time to replace them as I don't plan on having the mani or VC off again...preventative maintenance?

Anything else to do while the valve cover is off?

Oh also taking that coil pack remnant out, sprayed a bunch of corrosion all into the valve train, woo. Definitely some frequent oil changes.

Hoping it doesn't end up as physical timing chain issues after all this jazz.
 

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Can't see the picture - you may not have posted enough posts to qualify so just add some posts - we'll know what you are trying to do!

Some 3.2 engines have needed new timing chains.

VW's supplier didn't bother renewing the tools in the presses used for stamping out the links so chains can stretch.

They usually announce themselves as heading in that direction by getting rather noisy.

The engine was originally designed to be inserted into engine bays on an East-West basis but in the Touareg, instead of it being installed North-South so the timing chain is at the front, it was deemed a good idea to install it South-North so the chain is at the rear -an engine out job unless you have very small hands!
 

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Discussion Starter #12
When driving the treg previously to this break down there wasn't any rattling, bit of rattling during the stalling and attempting to diagnose this but I've never heard it before and the engine is bogging pretty hard to pretty tough to isolate what's going on. I'd hate to do all of this work and find out it needs a timing chain, so be it if it does I guess.

Can't see the picture - you may not have posted enough posts to qualify so just add some posts - we'll know what you are trying to do!

Some 3.2 engines have needed new timing chains.

VW's supplier didn't bother renewing the tools in the presses used for stamping out the links so chains can stretch.

They usually announce themselves as heading in that direction by getting rather noisy.

The engine was originally designed to be inserted into engine bays on an East-West basis but in the Touareg, instead of it being installed North-South so the timing chain is at the front, it was deemed a good idea to install it South-North so the chain is at the rear -an engine out job unless you have very small hands!
 

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That milky, mayonaise look is the kind of thing you see when there is coolant in the oil such as, for example, when the head gasket goes.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
That milky, mayonaise look is the kind of thing you see when there is coolant in the oil such as, for example, when the head gasket goes.
Certainly possible, the dipstick is reading clean and the car has been driven infrequently if at all for 6 months, and when driven probably for 5 minutes so it might just be a bunch of condensation. Especially likely to be condensation because it's localized around the PCV? Open to any more opinions/logic
 

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Discussion Starter #16
There's so much dusty corrosion in the furthest cyl (still can't even get the socket on the plug) there's no way that cylinder was firing... I've been picking away at the dust and vacuuming it out for a while now. I also removed the upper tensioner bolt and was fiddling with it and the piston shot right out across my garage! Was planning on replacing that anyways as preventative maintenance since it's easy to access right now. I pulled both my cam sensors and they were quite dirty, one seems to be okay (going to get a voltmeter to test them after), but the other's metal cap was spinning while I was cleaning it, so I figure I'll replace that one. OE cam sensor is $160, can you tell me how silly it would be of me to replace just one? Or how about getting two aftermarket sensors?

I've been inspecting the creamy sludge and it just doesn't smell like coolant at all, just smells like oil. No oil in the coolant, no milky-ness on the dipstick. Honestly I would hate to do all of this tear down and tune up and find a head gasket blown. Any more thoughts would be appreciated. Looking to pull the trigger on parts today.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Also the treggy was missing an intake manifold bolt..! Anyone have the priming procedure and torque spec for the upper tensioner bolt?
 

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Well I finally got the PCV off, silly me basically broke the thing thinking it was suctioned in by the nipple - just had to pop the tabs in... I'll be getting a new one anyways.

Inspected the coils, the furthest cylinder's coil was basically fused to the spark plug tube, the upper section of the coil broke off leaving the metal tube lodged in there. I figured this was a good time to remove the intake manifold and valve cover to 1. get the coil fully out and 2. inspect the valve train, take a peak around. Took about 6 hours! Fun times working behind that engine... That bracket back there is a racket.

I got the coil pack out, but there is some weird creamy looking oil/sludge all over the timing area and I saw it in the PCV tube, it's also all in the valve cover where the PCV tube enters. Any idea on that? Reading that it's likely condensation, the treg hasn't been driven much for months and it's pretty cold here, the PCV may also not have been operating properly.

Going to be giving it hard runs and changing the oil at a higher frequency if/when I get this thing running again.

I imagine there will also not be a better time to change the cams sensors than this, I can get to them pretty easily - they also look pretty cruddy as I have the valve cover off and can see the magnets.

So I'm thinking... PCV valve, coils, plugs, air filter, I broke some vacuum hose that has a hard section going into a rubber section, to the left of the engine - I'll have to look that up or see if I can rig it together.'

Throw two cam sensors at it, because they seem to go bad and there's never going to be a better time to replace them as I don't plan on having the mani or VC off again...preventative maintenance?

Anything else to do while the valve cover is off?

Oh also taking that coil pack remnant out, sprayed a bunch of corrosion all into the valve train, woo. Definitely some frequent oil changes.

Hoping it doesn't end up as physical timing chain issues after all this jazz.
Sounds like you broke a hard nipple push pull connector going into the intake manifold on the left side. To fix cut off remnant flush. Buy a small section of gas line with same size push pull connector. Cut gas line to to length needed. Drill intake hole to dimension needed, or just heat up the right diameter bolt and screw into opening while hot and unscrew. if you drill make sure to vacuum. Gorilla glue the gas line to the intake which is essentially plastic. Have enough length in the pipe that about 1/4 inch is protruding into the intake. If you are worried about any drilling debris use the hot screw method, or take off the throttle body and you can vacuum the intake from that point. Broke one of mine when laying across the intake and putting my hand/weight wrong place. Solution works fine no leak and not likely to break again if place hand in wrong place.

The timing chain noise can be very subtle and diminishes when engine is at operating temperature. Will sound somewhat-like marbles rolling around in a can center of dashboard. My chain has been stretched for some time. Car runs fine but not as good as it could. Sounds a little different, more bass but still has some get up and go and can fly on the highway. I check the measuring blocks occasionally and the problem has not gotten worse as block values are pretty much the same, but also in the range that indicates chain is stretched. I pretty much change the oil twice a year regardless of mileage. May have helped prevent further chain stretching, but just my speculation.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Sounds like you broke a hard nipple push pull connector going into the intake manifold on the left side. To fix cut off remnant flush. Buy a small section of gas line with same size push pull connector. Cut gas line to to length needed. Drill intake hole to dimension needed, or just heat up the right diameter bolt and screw into opening while hot and unscrew. if you drill make sure to vacuum. Gorilla glue the gas line to the intake which is essentially plastic. Have enough length in the pipe that about 1/4 inch is protruding into the intake. If you are worried about any drilling debris use the hot screw method, or take off the throttle body and you can vacuum the intake from that point. Broke one of mine when laying across the intake and putting my hand/weight wrong place. Solution works fine no leak and not likely to break again if place hand in wrong place.

The timing chain noise can be very subtle and diminishes when engine is at operating temperature. Will sound somewhat-like marbles rolling around in a can center of dashboard. My chain has been stretched for some time. Car runs fine but not as good as it could. Sounds a little different, more bass but still has some get up and go and can fly on the highway. I check the measuring blocks occasionally and the problem has not gotten worse as block values are pretty much the same, but also in the range that indicates chain is stretched. I pretty much change the oil twice a year regardless of mileage. May have helped prevent further chain stretching, but just my speculation.
Thankfully it wasn't one of the push pulls, it was the hard portion of a vacuum line that slid over a brass nipple, on some sort of vacuum reservoir/part to the left of the TB.

I stole some 3mm vac hose off my jetta and it fit over both ends snuggly, i'll vac test it as well.

Since the car is not running right now, stripped down, I'll have to finish replacing the coils/plugs, cam sensors, and upper tensioner bolt before diagnosing the timing belt further. I find it hard to believe that the treg was firing on that fused cylinder, i used compressed air to blow out the plug hole while holding a shop vac over the hole, 2/6 spark plugs were rusted and I think whoever did the ignition maintenance didn't change them because they couldn't get the coils out.

Anyhow hopefully this bout of regular maintenance clears up the misfires and there wasn't an actual timing stretch issue, I am decently optimistic.
 

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