Front Differential Failures common? - Page 3 - Club Touareg Forums
View Poll Results: Has your Front or Rear Differential Failed or makes noise?
I hear the grinding sound in my front differential 22 81.48%
I have replaced my front differential already 5 18.52%
I have a failure or pending failure in my rear differential 5 18.52%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 27. You may not vote on this poll

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post #21 of 30 Old 04-10-2019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2005 Touareg View Post
Does anyone currently have a pinion and crush sleeve removed from the front differential of a 2004-2006 V8 Touareg? I need the ID and OD of the crush sleeve so that I can manufacture shims and attempt to reuse the original crush sleeve.
Why not machine a solid sleeve instead? I did. If need be, you can make it undersized then shim up to get proper preload, this also allows you to work on shimming the pinion if need be and not ruin a crush sleeve. BTW, I plan on posting up what I did with my front diff rebuild after I get it on the road. I did quite a bit for a rebuild but I want to see how it pans out before I make too many suggestions. I have m crush sleeve out if you want the measurements. BTW [email protected]#$! ZF
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post #22 of 30 Old 04-10-2019
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As Pilot said a fixed sleeve is the way to go in a perfect world just the average guy will struggle with the concept and i applaud him for that🤗
How did you get on with the pinion contacts etc Pilot ?
Attached is what i use to do my setups

Regards
Drag

Quote:
Originally Posted by pilot60378 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2005 Touareg View Post
Does anyone currently have a pinion and crush sleeve removed from the front differential of a 2004-2006 V8 Touareg? I need the ID and OD of the crush sleeve so that I can manufacture shims and attempt to reuse the original crush sleeve.
Why not machine a solid sleeve instead? I did. If need be, you can make it undersized then shim up to get proper preload, this also allows you to work on shimming the pinion if need be and not ruin a crush sleeve. BTW, I plan on posting up what I did with my front diff rebuild after I get it on the road. I did quite a bit for a rebuild but I want to see how it pans out before I make too many suggestions. I have m crush sleeve out if you want the measurements. BTW [email protected]#$! ZF
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pilot60378 (04-11-2019)
post #23 of 30 Old 04-11-2019
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Dragline:
Well, after finally realizing that my backlash and gear pattern were greatly affected by installing the cover, I had to start all over again.

Everytime I wanted to check gear pattern and backlash, I had to install the cover then carefully remove it and check.

So since I had to start over, I used the original pinion shim and carrier shims and checked. Pattern indicated the pinion was too far away from the ring gear with contact of the drive side at the toe and towards the crown and coast side at the heel. Backlash was .012" so no go there.

I had a .010" pinion shim that I picked up at my local repair shop that he gave me. I installed that and checked again. The pattern wasn't perfect but looked good enough I felt ok to run it. Backlash was a little tight at .0035"-.004" using the original carrier shims. With that set up and the solid crush sleeve, my preload was around 12lb/in. At this point I was pretty well done with it. I have had the Treg down around a month so my patience was done haha.

This was a hell of an experience and I don't think I could have accomplished it without your help Dragline! Not to mention my father who did the lathe work.

I don't know how well you can see my final pattern but the drive side was still a little more towards toe but the coast was smack dab in the middle. I feel if I could have gone maybe another .003"-.005" added to the pinion, it would have been perfect but didn't want to go through the hassle of making another set of carrier shims.

I will know how it is when I drive it. During removal, I snapped the front left subframe bolt in two. That in itself has been the real challenge. Once that's out of the way, she's back together. If all goes well, I plan on posting up my method for rebuild on here with as much detail as I can.
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post #24 of 30 Old 04-11-2019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pilot60378 View Post
Why not machine a solid sleeve instead? I did. If need be, you can make it undersized then shim up to get proper preload, this also allows you to work on shimming the pinion if need be and not ruin a crush sleeve. BTW, I plan on posting up what I did with my front diff rebuild after I get it on the road. I did quite a bit for a rebuild but I want to see how it pans out before I make too many suggestions. I have m crush sleeve out if you want the measurements. BTW [email protected]#$! ZF
Hey Pilot lol I love your closing comment. Your suggestion is the best option, also thanks to Dragline who said the same. I don't have a lathe but found someone who is willing to make a solid sleeve and set up the differential for me. I had the work scheduled but when the Differential fluid was drained after 6000-miles there was no metal found, so I'm back to square 1, verify the diagnosis. Thanks
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post #25 of 30 Old 04-11-2019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2005 Touareg View Post
Hey Pilot lol I love your closing comment. Your suggestion is the best option, also thanks to Dragline who said the same. I don't have a lathe but found someone who is willing to make a solid sleeve and set up the differential for me. I had the work scheduled but when the Differential fluid was drained after 6000-miles there was no metal found, so I'm back to square 1, verify the diagnosis. Thanks
What sort of issues are/were you having with your differential? Just because there isn't any metal flake doesn't necessarily mean there isn't a problem with the diff setup.
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post #26 of 30 Old 04-12-2019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pilot60378 View Post
What sort of issues are/were you having with your differential? Just because there isn't any metal flake doesn't necessarily mean there isn't a problem with the diff setup.
A growl developed under acceleration/decelleration. Loudest in Neutral coasting at 30-mph. I suspected the front differential so dropped the gear oil and found a a sheen of metalic on the surface. Disassembled inspected and replaced the carrier bearings. Left carrier bearing was slightly worn (a little loose in the cage) but not bad. Pinion turned smoothly with preload intacted so I didn't disassemble (no crush sleeve). Re-assembled and still have the same problem. Perhaps related or not, there is a shudder in the vehicle between 25-45 mph. It seems to occur when the torque converter modulates into lockup.
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post #27 of 30 Old 4 Weeks Ago
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2005 Touareg View Post
A growl developed under acceleration/decelleration. Loudest in Neutral coasting at 30-mph. I suspected the front differential so dropped the gear oil and found a a sheen of metalic on the surface. Disassembled inspected and replaced the carrier bearings. Left carrier bearing was slightly worn (a little loose in the cage) but not bad. Pinion turned smoothly with preload intacted so I didn't disassemble (no crush sleeve). Re-assembled and still have the same problem. Perhaps related or not, there is a shudder in the vehicle between 25-45 mph. It seems to occur when the torque converter modulates into lockup.
Touareg: It seems the main issue in these diffs come from the carrier bearings not being properly lubricated. I put 2qts in when I reassembled. The shudder is most likely the valve body in the trans. Although, the diff could be contributing to the trans not shifting as smoothly. That aside, it could be the pinion bearings as well.

I just got my diff reinstalled yesterday evening. So far no leaks and she's as quiet as she's ever been. The shifts became even smoother as well. I did do a trans fluid drain and refill a couple years ago with new filter which helped some, but it still shuttered some.

I'll be doing some interstate driving this week and I plan on posting my method of rebuilding the diff as well as resources for parts next weekend hopefully. I don't know if you can wait that long before you start your rebuild, but my method might make it go a little easier for you.

Mine is an '04 Treg V8 with rear locking diff and air almost 200k miles on it.
Good luck,
Pilot
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post #28 of 30 Old 4 Weeks Ago
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pilot60378 View Post
Touareg: It seems the main issue in these diffs come from the carrier bearings not being properly lubricated. I put 2qts in when I reassembled. The shudder is most likely the valve body in the trans. Although, the diff could be contributing to the trans not shifting as smoothly. That aside, it could be the pinion bearings as well.

I just got my diff reinstalled yesterday evening. So far no leaks and she's as quiet as she's ever been. The shifts became even smoother as well. I did do a trans fluid drain and refill a couple years ago with new filter which helped some, but it still shuttered some.

I'll be doing some interstate driving this week and I plan on posting my method of rebuilding the diff as well as resources for parts next weekend hopefully. I don't know if you can wait that long before you start your rebuild, but my method might make it go a little easier for you.

Mine is an '04 Treg V8 with rear locking diff and air almost 200k miles on it.
Good luck,
Pilot

PILOT: Did the Differential rebuild resolve your Shudder???

I am not certain yet what the Shudder issue is. It could be the rear driveshaft carrier bearing which may also be the cause of the growl i'm hearing. I have inspected the bearing and it appears to be in good condition.

I bought the Ross-Tech Scanner and have been evaluating transmission shift data. What I have found is that the shudder occurs when the Torque Converter Clutch is engaged (which is "condition 1" in the data). That may imply that there isn't enough hydraulic pressure on the clutch, and hence, a valve body problem. I am not having the typical symptoms of valve body failure (ie: hard back shifts or up shifts, rpm flare between shifts.)

Did you find a considerable amount of metal in your differential fluid when drained Before the rebuild???

Looking forward to see your rebuild procedure here.
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post #29 of 30 Old 3 Weeks Ago
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2005 Touareg View Post
PILOT: Did the Differential rebuild resolve your Shudder???

I am not certain yet what the Shudder issue is. It could be the rear driveshaft carrier bearing which may also be the cause of the growl i'm hearing. I have inspected the bearing and it appears to be in good condition.

I bought the Ross-Tech Scanner and have been evaluating transmission shift data. What I have found is that the shudder occurs when the Torque Converter Clutch is engaged (which is "condition 1" in the data). That may imply that there isn't enough hydraulic pressure on the clutch, and hence, a valve body problem. I am not having the typical symptoms of valve body failure (ie: hard back shifts or up shifts, rpm flare between shifts.)

Did you find a considerable amount of metal in your differential fluid when drained Before the rebuild???

Looking forward to see your rebuild procedure here.
As far as elimintaing the shudder, no, reducing the intensity, yes somewhat. On the first time I rebuilt the diff, yes, plenty of metal in the oil. The condition of the carrier bearings and races dictated that. On the second go of a rebuild, not really any metal in there and it's possible that what was in there I didn't get out completely the first time. The bearings and races looked good this time.

So here's my write-up, hope it makes sense and it's useful. Enjoy! https://www.clubtouareg.com/forums/f...ml#post2045989
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post #30 of 30 Old 1 Week Ago
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2005 Touareg View Post
Does anyone currently have a pinion and crush sleeve removed from the front differential of a 2004-2006 V8 Touareg? I need the ID and OD of the crush sleeve so that I can manufacture shims and attempt to reuse the original crush sleeve.
If you reuse the crush washer Heat it in the your oven at the highest setting to anneal it. Sorry don't know what tempurature it needs but hotter is better.
These washers are work hardening. After the first use they harden.
After the annealing you should be able to tap the center to lengthen the washer.
Then anneal again to soften.
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