Brake Controller Basics + Prodigy Solution - Page 2 - Club Touareg Forums
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post #11 of 135 Old 01-12-2011 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benhchang View Post
The diagram posted by SteveK-0 and the thread is really helpful. On the diagram itself, for P3 installation do you wire the P3 to the brake lamp signal or to the brake pedal switch.

Thanks

Ben
Take a look at this thread where I posted the Touareg schematics:
Trailer Circuit Diagram

The short answer is that if you wire to the brake pedal switch, you would avoid having to add the relay, but you would not get any benefit from automatic anti-sway control if it is there. This would be true to if you wired to the lamp signal. What you are supposed to wire to is neither one, it is an output from a the Towing Control Module.

I tried wiring from the Towing Control Module, per the schematic and experienced the reported problem with noise on that line making the P3 think it was seeing braking. I did not put a scope on it, but it was not CAN, it was likely pulses scanning for load as it does with the brake lights. I had to put in a relay per the technical bulletin above.

Hope that helps.

SteveK-O

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post #12 of 135 Old 01-12-2011
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I kinda sorta understand the schematics

1st of all, I have 2004 V8 Touareg with Air Suspension. What I want to accomplish is to be able to tow a trailer with 911 to the track. I already installed the OEM hitch and OEM Towing Control Module and VAG it. Now I am in the process of installing the P3. With the P3, I will only connect it when I am towing and I will remove it when I am not towing.

From what you are saying, SteveK-O is that I do not need a relay if I am gonna connect it to the brake pedal switch. This sounds simple enough. But what is this "Anti-Sway Control"? Is this an option on the Touareg or the Trailer? If it is on a Touareg, how do I know if I have this option?

Based on the many helpful threads, yours and JFScheck what I was gonna do is connect P3 to the Brake Pedal Switch with the relay switch. The purpose of the relay is so that it will not drain the battery. Pls advice whether I need the relay or not. Also connect the 30amp inline fuse to the main power.
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post #13 of 135 Old 01-13-2011
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Search for my detailed instructions on both vehicles - for those with a 2004 up to 2007 - you tap into the brake switch , find my instructions and you will see exact pics of the switch, wire etc.

Same for those asking about the relay (2007 onwards) which is for latter vehicles where the brake switch has been moved to the other side of the firewall...

Benhchang - no relay needed for your 2004.


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post #14 of 135 Old 01-13-2011
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What is the purpose of the yellow wires (part #00097922? Why can't you just connect the Tekonsha wiring into the VW plug housing (part #1J0-972-782) directly, then plug into the vehicle brake control connector (and red/black wire on the brake switch)?
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post #15 of 135 Old 01-13-2011 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benhchang View Post
I kinda sorta understand the schematics
Quote:
Originally Posted by benhchang View Post

1st of all, I have 2004 V8 Touareg with Air Suspension. What I want to accomplish is to be able to tow a trailer with 911 to the track.
I am glad to help a p-car brother get to the track. I am currently driving my 987 to the track, but I switched to Hooiser R6 track tires last year so that will be hard to do from now on. One of the reasons I researched this is to prepare for an enclosed car-hauler.

Anyway, here is a video on the concept of trailer sway control. Watch for the little skid marks indicating braking.


The guy on the right does not do anything when swaying starts and it does not go well for him. The guy in the middle slows and applies the brakes to stop the sway. Both the truck brakes and trailer brakes are applied at the same time. The guy on the left has the Ford trailer sway control. The controller applies the brakes on the trailer automatically when trailer sway is detected. I think it is better for the trailer to be braking when the truck is not braking to stop the trailer sway.

To do the trailer sway control, the stability control system would need to know at trailer is attached. The trailer control module detects the trailer and sends out a CAN message. If the stability control system detects sway and the trailer control module has announced a trailer is there, it would send a CAN message to the trailer control module to apply the trailer brakes. So, for this to work, the trailer control module needs to be able to independently apply the trailer brakes when it decides to.

I am not 100% this is how the Touareg system works. I have seen somewhere it has trailer sway control, but I have not been able to find out more about it. Looking at the Touareg schematic, it fits with what I have written above. If it does need the ability to independently control the trailer brakes, there is no reason to have made the system as complex as it is, even for Germans. I am not going to run the experiment to see if it is there, too exciting.

So, if you want to take advantage of what the trailer control module was designed to do, you need to use the output of the module to signal the brake controller, not the brake switch. The brake switch will work for normal driving, but the trailer control module would have no way to independently apply the trailer brakes.

If you installed the towing control module, did it come with a wiring harness? How is the wiring done from the controller to the 7-pin connector? If you have a harness, do you have the 4-pin connector that is designed to connect to the brake controller? Take a look at the wiring diagram again. The 7-pin connector to the trailer is supposed to get 5 of its wires from the towing control module, the 6th is a ground, and the 7th one comes from the brake controller. The brake controller gets power, ground, the input from the towing control module and has its output to the 7-pin connector. If this is not clear pm me and we can talk it over.

SteveK-O

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post #16 of 135 Old 01-13-2011 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adwriter73 View Post
What is the purpose of the yellow wires (part #00097922? Why can't you just connect the Tekonsha wiring into the VW plug housing (part #1J0-972-782) directly, then plug into the vehicle brake control connector (and red/black wire on the brake switch)?
The yellow wires are pre-terminated with the spades that fit into the VW plug housing. The VW plug housing is just a piece of cool plastic with no terminals. The wires have a terminal crimped on each each, that is why you only need 2 wires to make the 4 terminals, you cut them in half.

SteveK-O

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post #17 of 135 Old 01-14-2011
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Hey SteveK-O,

Now I am learning about anti-sway control. Very kool stuff. Thanks for the youtube. I definitely want to enable the trailer to brake automatically.

Yes it did come with the wiring harness.
Please take a look at the pics.

If I want to enable the anti-sway control, your recommendation is to wire it exactly to TB0021.

Thanks a bunch
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post #18 of 135 Old 01-14-2011 Thread Starter
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Your lower left picture looks like the correct 4-pin connector for the brake controller. Yes, I recommend wiring per the service bulletin and connecting to it.

So simplify the wiring, the "Hot at all times" input shown to the relay can come off the Black (Pin 2) line because it is hot at all times and is already fed through a properly sized fuse.

Also, the "Ground" connection to the relay can come off the White (Pin 1) line because it is ground.

This how I wired mine up and it is working great. Although I have not tested the sway control and hope it never has to engage.

SteveK-O

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post #19 of 135 Old 01-14-2011
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Got it!!!
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post #20 of 135 Old 01-15-2011 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benhchang View Post
Got it!!!
Looks good.

SteveK-O

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